I apologize for the length and disjointed nature of this message, but I'm on the
digest, so it's hard to keep up with all the comments as they come in.

Robert Schmid wrote:

"In THEORY, we are protected but in fact we would spend millions to recover
a fraction of the original loan.  Thus, again, let private sources assume
the risk.  Better yet, a public corporation where shareholders can choose
the level of risk they wish to commit to."

MAS: I'm not sure where you're getting this argument from.  Now if the team were
locked into a long-term lease, it's possible they could attempt to break it and 
public money would be spent fighting that.  If there's a loan, it's a loan, 
plain and simple.  It gets enforced.  Not even bankruptcy would allow a teams 
owners to skip on what's owed.  

As far as a public corporation, I would be all for that too.  Ask anybody from 
Green Bay and they'll tell you how great it's worked out for them with the 
Packers.  If our political leaders could put together a plan and get Major 
League Baseball to approve a sale to a public corporation, then I'd be honored 
to buy shares in the Twins.  This reinforces my point that it's political will, 
not money, that is the major stumbling block here.

Gary Bowman wrote:

"I've said it before and will again.  It's immensely ironic that the business 
community is so quick to chant "less government, less taxes, free market" when 
there's talk of public investment in social programs but have no problem going 
to the trough when they're the recipients (and I'd argue far less needy ones).

I also will strenuously argue to my dying breath that businesspeople smart 
enough, talented enough, and having enough resources to make the immense wealth 
they have DO HAVE the ability to build a stadium themselves.  The reality is 
they're smart enough, talented enough, and have enough resources to know that 
it's not a wise investment.  Hence, let someone else pay for it."

MAS: I agree that many corporations are hypocrites.  But that's not the point 
here.  I'm trying to advocate the voice of the fan.  If there were a way to 
build the ballpark fully from private funds in this market, I have to believe it
would have been done by now.  My hope is to find some kind of puublic-private 
partnership that allows the team to stay without being a total loser for the 
taxpayers.  I think my proposal at least moves in that direction and shows that 
the problem is less about dollars and more about the lack of political will.

Bruce Gaarder wrote:

"Another part involves the number of people buying tickets at each price.
I seem to remember a lot of Twins PR about how many tickets are available
for $4 or so.  Those folks wouldn't likely be happy about paying $3-$4
more per ticket.  

As has been pointed out recently, teams with new stadiums lose a lot of money.

[snip]

If there are 100,000 fans who would be so devastated to lose the Twins,
each should take out a $3,000 loan for three or four years and combine
the funds to build a park.  That would run about $75 a month."

MAS: Maybe Bruce missed it, but part of my proposal suggested a progressive 
surcharge, specifically to keep the cheap seats cheap.  Also, those who have 
attended games in the past season or more can attest that upper deck general 
admission seats (which were actually $5) were still not very popular due to the 
lousy view.  Lower level general admission tickets were $10 each, a better value
on an hourly basis for your entertainment dollar than going to a movie.

I'd also like to see Bruce back up his claim about teams with new ballparks 
being money-losers.  Which teams and how much were their losses?  Were there any
other circumstances involved that may have contributed to losses, such as a 
lousy product on the field or social backlash because the team has players or 
owners that are jerks?

As far as the personal loan idea, if I thought it would work, I'd be the first 
to sign up.  Unfortunately, there aren't a lot of baseball fans that could 
afford such a proposal.  My proposal works out to maybe a dime per taxpayer per 
year in unrecovered interest on a loan (I assumed 5% interest and 2 million 
taxpayers in a quick calculation).  Are there that many of us who are so hung up
on anti-corporate principle that we're unwilling to give up one thin dime per 
year?

Mark Snyder
Ward 1/Windom Park
  

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