The totality of Mr. Erwin's post proves the truth contained in the final sentence of his first paragraph where he says "Perhaps we are all tyrannical!". Yes, this city is.
One more time on the smoking ban: the smoking ban is tyrannical because it is another example of oppressive power exerted by government. The smoking ban wasn't needed if those with enough faith in the market would allow it to do its job. The smoking ban hurts those bars where the proponents of the ban would never, ever stoop low enough to ever go into, if even to use the phone or the toilet. 99% of smoking ban proponents will never deign to patronize 99% of the bars affected by this ban. The smoking ban is elitist and patronizing and oppressive.... brought to us by the same people who regularly whine about oppression and talk about making Minneaplis business friendly. Sure. I'm sorry that people like Mr. Erwin find it inconvenient to wash their clothes after coming home from a bar. But there's a simple solution to that: stay out of them. Again, because such a decision apparently is too difficult and beyond the scope of those made by many Minneapolis adults, the city council, white hats and all, can come to our rescue and ease us from the burdens of adult decision making, all the while smiling for helping us help ourselves. Gak. In regards to the shopping cart problem-du-jour: To fine the victims of crimes (the Cubs and the Rainbows and the K-Marts) is absolutely ridiculous. It's a slippery slope that should scare the hell out of law-abiding citizens. Thieves steal the carts from stores! Criminals. It matters not that the carts are an eyesore when left on the streets. The thieves left them there. In essense, they're also littering. For the sake of God, let's have some common sense here. To fine the likes of Cub and K-Mart for people stealing their property is akin to saying to Cub and K-Mart "you made your stuff too damn attractive. It's your fault people are stealing it." The stores aren't the problem, folks, it's the criminals. I know we're all fed up with crime. But to hold crime victims responsible for the crimes perpetrated agaisnt them is a new low. (I also suspect that this ordinance is aimed at the "deep pockets" of the corporates like Cub and K-Mart. Another untapped revenue source, I guess.) Mike Thompson Windom Life-long non-smoker LRT: 2 MPPA: 0 ----- Original Message ----- From: "John Erwin" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 8:16 AM Subject: [Mpls] RE: Smoking and Carts > > > > Keith says: > "Gary Schiff is trying so hard to fill Jackie Cherryhomes' tyrannical shoes. > > He must believe there is not much on the front burner while he is busy > keeping working stiffs from lighting up at their corner bar. Or he is busy > creating an arcane rental application fee ordinance that does not address > real needs of tenants, nor landlords; and hence our City as a whole. Now Cub > is guilty when their shopping cart is stolen. I ask; is Gary in the house? > Perhaps whenever young Gary misbehaved; Mom would slap his brother?" > > > John Erwin responds > > Think Keith's comments are over the line. I have heard nothing but support > for these changes and they are long overdue. . . .residents in my > neighborhood are nothing but supportive of them from what I can tell. > Perhaps we are all tyrannical! > > Specifically, hats off to Gary on the smoking ban. . . . as far as keeping > working stiffs from lighting up - they can - they just can't increase the > risk of innocent bystanders in getting cancer - by doing it in an enclosed > area. Sounds reasonable to me and I appreciate it - not to mention the > reduced clothes washing that most everyone has to do after going to a bar in > the past - think of the reduced pollution! LOL! I think a huge number of > people are happy with this change including everyone that has come to visit > me from out of town - a great change for our city all around. > > Again, hats off for Gary supporting the issue of fining stores for their > carts littering neighborhoods. I think that you would see nothing but > support from residents around these stores for this change as they have to > deal with carts in the streets and in front of their stores regularly as I > do as I weave around carts in streets to get to these places. I have often > seen employees look the other way. This does nothing more than create more > of an incentive for store managers to work with their employees to insure > the carts stay where they belong. > > Don't know enough about the landlords issue to talk about it. > > Sincerely, > John Erwin > > REMINDERS: > 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. > > 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. > > For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html > For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract > ________________________________ > > Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy > Post messages to: mailto:[email protected] > Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls > > REMINDERS: 1. Be civil! Please read the NEW RULES at http://www.e-democracy.org/rules. If you think a member is in violation, contact the list manager at [EMAIL PROTECTED] before continuing it on the list. 2. Don't feed the troll! Ignore obvious flame-bait. For state and national discussions see: http://e-democracy.org/discuss.html For external forums, see: http://e-democracy.org/mninteract ________________________________ Minneapolis Issues Forum - A Civil City-focused Civic Discussion - Mn E-Democracy Post messages to: mailto:[email protected] Subscribe, Un-subscribe, etc. at: http://e-democracy.org/mpls
