Hi Nuno, Thanks for this opportunity to allow me to help you understand audio latency on Android better.
Contributions to total round-trip audio latency on Android are best thought as stemming from two parts. A) Android service space (AudioFlinger etc) ← developers and middleware cannot affect latency here. B) Android user space (App, DSP components, OpenSL ES) ← developers and middleware can do quite lot to lower latency here. Yes, the Superpowered Audio SDK (or any other API) can't improve OpenSL ES audio latency itself when it comes to talking to the operating system's audio stack, OpenSL ES is the only legal way to do that (right now). FWIW Glenn Kasten mentioned at Google IO that the Pro Audio team is considering other audio APIs. 0) HOWEVER, in Android user space, the Superpowered Audio SDK radically improves latency down to 0 (zero/nada/zilch) as compared to components offered by OpenSL ES, such as players and effects. 1) It is also worth mentioning Superpowered does away with Android/Open SL ES’s fragmentation issues. OpenSL ES feature availability varies between the different devices, while every Superpowered feature is available on all. (We also offer considerably more features than OpenSL ES offers.) 2) Let’s not forget higher performance and higher battery life. Superpowered outperforms every other audio API, including the extremely high quality and industry benchmark, Core Audio by Apple. 3) Cross-platform code. Superpowered code is copy-paste between iOS, tvOS, OSX and Android. Back to Android service space latency, we’re putting the finishing touches on a new media server for Android. A new media server that performs reliable, glitch-free sub-10ms round trip audio latency. You’ll hear more about that later. Having spent time 'in the trenches' of Android audio, we want to take care to note that we respect all of pioneering work that the Google Pro Audio team has had to do, in making Android better (A thankless and brutal task). And that we share the goal of making Android the best possible audio platform it can be. Any more comments, Nuno? At your disposal, Patrick CEO, Superpowered Inc. On Wed, May 25, 2016 at 11:00 AM, Nuno Santos <nunosan...@imaginando.pt> wrote: > Patrick, > > Now that I had the chance of using Superpowered all I can say is that it > doesn’t make miracles. It will not provide lower latency than OpenSL > already gives. Android latency problem is much OS and device dependent. > > Looking forward to understand what is new and if it will bring any special > improvements to our products. > > Regards, > > Nuno Santos > Founder / CEO / CTO > www.imaginando.pt > +351 91 621 69 62 > > On 25 May 2016, at 16:26, Patrick Vlaskovits <vlaskov...@gmail.com> wrote: > > Speaking of Android, we just released a fully configuarable and performant > USB Audio and MIDI library for Android. It’s the Android equivalent of iOS > Core Audio and Core MIDI for USB devices. > > http://superpowered.com/android-usb-audio-android-midi > > The Superpowered USB Audio and MIDI SDK provides stable, professional, low > latency, low jitter, multi-channel audio and MIDI functionality for more > than 1 billion active Android devices, letting Android users fully > experience and express the sonic power of that Android powered > super-computer in their pocket unmuted. > > -Patrick > CEO, Superpowered Inc. > > > > > On Wed, May 25, 2016 at 8:15 AM, Nuno Santos <nunosan...@imaginando.pt> > wrote: > >> I have been testing DRC in 2 different Android devices: Nexus 9 >> (48000/128 buffer size) phone, Bq Aquaris M5 phone (48000/912) buffer size >> >> Nexus 9 is a beast. I was able to run DRC with full polyphony (8 voices) >> without any kind of glitch. The fake touches hack was essential to make >> this happen. Without the fake touches hack I would hear glitches. >> Bq Aquarius M5 has a very similar processor to Nexus 6P and I couldn’t >> have more than 2 voices running without having some glitches. >> >> All DSP code is C++. Reverb, Delay and Chorus represent half of the >> processing effort the rest is for active voices. >> From my experiences I couldn’t see any kind of effect in performance by >> compiling the code with NEON enabled. For example, on my Bq phone for a 912 >> buffer size at 48000 my processing code would take the following time with >> the following flags enabled: >> >> -Os - ~5ms >> -O3 - ~5ms >> -Ofast - ~5ms >> -Ofast -mfpu=neon - ~5ms >> >> No significant changes in performance with different flags. What kind of >> flags are you guys using for your Android apps? >> >> I don’t need to worry with this on iOS though. It simply works! >> >> Regards, >> >> Nuno Santos >> Founder / CEO / CTO >> www.imaginando.pt >> +351 91 621 69 62 >> >> On 25 May 2016, at 12:24, Jean-Baptiste Thiebaut <jean-bapti...@roli.com> >> wrote: >> >> At JUCE / ROLI we've been working with Google for over a year to optimize >> audio latency, throttle, etc for cross platform apps. Our app is featured >> also in the Youtube video from Google IO, and it runs on some devices with >> performances comparable to iOS. >> >> Whether you are using JUCE or not, you're welcome to post on our forum ( >> forum.juce.com). >> >> Sent from my mobile >> >> On 25 May 2016, at 11:57, grh <g...@mur.at> wrote: >> >> Hallo! >> >> Thanks Nuno, it was a great demo ;) >> >> LG >> Georg >> >> On 2016-05-25 12:46, Nuno Santos wrote: >> Hi George, >> >> I would be interested in such a community as well. Specially regarding >> audio performance. We have recently released DRC (one of the apps that >> has been featured on Google I/O Android High Performance Audio) and we >> are mostly interested in squeezing performance out of it. It is >> incredible the performance differences between iOS and Android. The DSP >> code is shared among both and I still have glitch problems in Android >> powerful devices. >> >> One option could be creating a slack channel. >> >> Regards, >> >> Nuno Santos >> Founder / CEO / CTO >> www.imaginando.pt <http://www.imaginando.pt> >> +351 91 621 69 62 >> >> On 25 May 2016, at 11:36, grh <g...@mur.at <mailto:g...@mur.at >> <g...@mur.at>>> >> wrote: >> >> Hallo music-dsp list! >> >> Sorry for being off topic, but does someone know an active discussion >> group / mailing list about android audio? >> (There is quite a lot of progress lately, see for example [1]) >> 5 years ago a list was announced here [2], which does not seem to be >> active anymore ... >> >> We just created a simple android audio editor [3] and would be very much >> interested into a discussion of common infrastructure like audio >> plugins/effects (like SAPA from Samsung) or copy/paste between audio apps. >> I think that would be important for the audio ecosystem on Android. >> >> Thanks for any hints, >> LG >> Georg >> >> [1]: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F2ZDp-eNrh4 >> [2]: >> >> http://music-dsp.music.columbia.narkive.com/zbYgicxy/new-android-audio-developers-mailing-list >> [3]: >> >> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.auphonic.auphonicrecorder >> >> -- >> auphonic - audio post production software and web service >> http://auphonic.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> dupswapdrop: music-dsp mailing list >> music-dsp@music.columbia.edu >> https://lists.columbia.edu/mailman/listinfo/music-dsp >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> dupswapdrop: music-dsp mailing list >> music-dsp@music.columbia.edu >> https://lists.columbia.edu/mailman/listinfo/music-dsp >> >> >> >> -- >> auphonic - audio post production software and web service >> http://auphonic.com >> >> _______________________________________________ >> dupswapdrop: music-dsp mailing list >> music-dsp@music.columbia.edu >> https://lists.columbia.edu/mailman/listinfo/music-dsp >> >> >> -- >> >> >> *ROLI's **award-winning* >> < >> http://www.telegraph.co.uk/luxury/design/31520/the-seaboard-grand-piano-wins-designs-of-the-year-2014-award.html>* >> Seaboard >> GRAND, celebrated as the "**piano of the future* >> < >> http://edition.cnn.com/2013/09/27/tech/innovation/hans-zimmer-seaboard-future-piano/>*", >> >> is now joined by the **Seaboard RISE* >> <https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fGr7VbDiRNw>*, "**every bit as slimline >> and attractive as its bigger brother* >> <http://www.soundonsound.com/news?NewsID=18726>*". 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If you contact us by e-mail >> then we will store your name and address to facilitate communications. >> Any >> statements contained herein are those of the individual and not the >> organisation. >> _______________________________________________ >> dupswapdrop: music-dsp mailing list >> music-dsp@music.columbia.edu >> https://lists.columbia.edu/mailman/listinfo/music-dsp >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> dupswapdrop: music-dsp mailing list >> music-dsp@music.columbia.edu >> https://lists.columbia.edu/mailman/listinfo/music-dsp >> > > > > -- > > -Patrick > @pv --- (415) 347-1849 > > Have you checked your Android phone's latency yet? > http://superpowered.com/latency > _______________________________________________ > dupswapdrop: music-dsp mailing list > music-dsp@music.columbia.edu > https://lists.columbia.edu/mailman/listinfo/music-dsp > > > > _______________________________________________ > dupswapdrop: music-dsp mailing list > music-dsp@music.columbia.edu > https://lists.columbia.edu/mailman/listinfo/music-dsp > -- -Patrick @pv --- (415) 347-1849 Have you checked your Android phone's latency yet? http://superpowered.com/latency
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