Yeah. I got that part of it, and I don't disagree that many large carriers have less than stellar support.
Some things to consider when looking at the support you get from a large ISP... - Most problems you will have are going to be circuit problems - i.e. "my T-1 is down, AGAIN". Therefore, most carrier's support operations are built around fixing Layer 1 problems. You give them the circuit ID, and then, in theory, you get your circuit fixed. - Routing problems occur, but most are global, across a carrier's entire network, or regional, at a POP or POPs. There are many things that can cause this - bad router code, misconfiguration, etc. In a properly designed network, routing problems that impact a single user are rare. - Resources to assist customers in diagnosing routing problems are scarce, for a variety of reasons, some good, some very bad. This is compounded by the fact that the "hit rate" for customer routing problems is low. Most times when a customer calls and says that their T-3 is down, it really is. Most of the time when a customer calls and says they are having a BGP problem, it's rarely originated by the carrier, and is usually a customer misconfiguration or misunderstanding. - Daniel Golding > -----Original Message----- > From: Gregory Urban [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] > Sent: Friday, April 05, 2002 11:14 AM > To: Daniel Golding; [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: RE: Qwest Support > > > > You totally missed the point. Had this been a real emergency, he > would be > unable to get resolution since Qwest was unable to dredge up a > clue within > their customer support machine. > > Greg U > > At 05:24 PM 4/4/2002, you wrote: > > >I suppose. Except it's not even certain you were having a problem of any > >kind at all. > > > >Qwest's presence or absence from public IX's really has nothing > to do with > >your routes being announced. In fact, Qwest privately peers with all the > >other large networks. While there are many peering sessions at the public > >NAPs, most traffic is carried over private network > interconnects, at least > >domestically. Certain peering points in Europe (Linx), tend to > run the other > >way. > > > >In fact, if Qwest were publically peering with other networks, > it might be a > >reason why your routes through UUNet were being prefered - private peer > >originated routes are almost always assigned higher local preferences in > >carrier networks, then public peer originated routes. > > > >I'm not sure your annoyance with Qwest has any basis in their lack of > >performance, as far as IP routing. BGP decision rules and other networks' > >routing policies will govern which paths are used for your > routes. Here is > >an example... > > > >- Network X peers with UUNet in 8 locations. Network X also peers with > >Qwest, lets say in 6 locations. For whatever reason, network X chooses > >UUNet's routes to you over, Qwest's. This could be due to local routing > >policy, dictating that 701 routes get a higher local pref. Or AS path > >lengths could be the same, and the decision could be falling to something > >like router ID. Whatever. > > > >- In general, all the UUNet peering will get treated the same by > Network X's > >routing policy. This won't always be the case, but let's say that none of > >the peering links are congested, etc. So, a certain number of paths are > >carried throughout Network X via iBGP. If UUNet's routes "won" > at all those > >peering points, you will not see any paths through Qwest on a > single carrier > >route server like Nitrous. > > > >- Route-views, and the like are different animals. They get ebgp multihop > >views from many providers, so you will tend to see paths from > many different > >vantage points, and are more likely to see paths from both your > upstreams. > > > >ISPs get a heavy volume of calls every day. While Qwest may not have the > >greatest customer service, it's not like you were actually down or had a > >qwest originated routing issue. If that were the case, my > sympathy would be > >greater. > > > >- Daniel Golding > > > >-----Original Message----- > >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of > >Andy Dills > >Sent: Thursday, April 04, 2002 5:43 PM > >To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > >Subject: Qwest Support > > > > > > > > > >Wow, Qwest support is indeed terrible. > > > >Turned up the DS3 today...the connectivity seems fine. I decided to check > >a couple of routeservers (nitrous); all had my much-prepended UUnet > >announcement, but NONE had my Qwest announcement. Not a huge deal, but > >curious to me. Is Qwest just not at the public peering points? When I > >checked route-views.oregan-ix.net, I felt better, but yet annoyed. Even > >with the prepends, most networks were announcing UUnet's path. > > > >So I decided to call them and ask...man what a mistake. The guy is like, > >"Ok, hold on, let me get somebody from our IP noc." 10 minutes goes by, > >and he comes back with "Couldn't get anybody in the IP noc, let me try to > >get somebody in your install group" (being that I turned up the DS3 > >today). Comes back another 10 minutes later with "Well, I left a message > >for them, but there isn't much I can do. Nobody seems to be answering > >their phone. If somebody doesn't call you back within 30 minutes, here's > >a number to call..." > > > >So what if my routes were actually hosed? I'd just be screwed > because they > >can't get anybody at the IP noc? > > > >I wait. Nobody calls back within 30 minutes. I call the number > he gave me. > >Busy. You gotta be kidding me. > > > >So I call the main number again, talk to somebody different. She has me > >hold, and then brings some guy on the line "who can help me". I start to > >talk about route servers, and he's immediately like "Woah, this is a BGP > >problem...I can't help you. Let me try to get somebody from the IP noc." > > > >So, I wait on hold for about 15 minutes, only to be given dial tone. > > > >Please tell me it isn't always THIS bad? > > > >Andy > > > >xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > >Andy Dills 301-682-9972 > >Xecunet, LLC www.xecu.net > >xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx > >Dialup * Webhosting * E-Commerce * High-Speed Access >
