On 8/2/19 1:10 PM, JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via NANOG wrote:
The cost of sharing IPs in a static way, is that services such as Sony
Playstation Network will put those addresses in the black list, so you
need to buy more addresses. This hasn’t been the case for
464XLAT/NAT64, which shares the addresses dynamically.
Furthermore, if some users need less ports than others, you
“infra-utilize” those addresses, which again is not the case for
464XLAT/NAT64. Each user gets automatically as many ports as he needs
at every moment.
So, you save money in terms of addresses, that you can invest in a
couple of servers running a redundant NAT64 setup
(https://www.jool.mx/en/session-synchronization.html). Those servers
can be actually VMs, so you don’t need dedicated hardware, especially
because when you deploy IPv6 with 464XLAT, typically 75% (and going
up) of you traffic will be IPv6 and only 25% will go thru the NAT64.
You work on much smaller networks than I do if a "couple of servers
running Jool" can handle your load. Jool is great, and the team that
built it is great, but a couple of 10Gbps NICs on a pizza box doesn't go
very far. I've tried 100Gbps and can't get the throughput with any
normal CPU. Hoping to get back to it and run some actual measurements.
Lee
Regards,
Jordi
@jordipalet
El 2/8/19 18:24, "NANOG en nombre de Baldur Norddahl"
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> en nombre de
[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> escribió:
The goal is to minimize cost. Assuming 4 bits for the MAP routing (16
users sharing one IPv4), leaving 12 bits for customer ports (4096
ports) and a current price of USD 20 per IPv4 address, this gives a
cost of USD 1.25 per user for a fully redundant solution. For us it is
even cheaper as we can recirculate existing address space.
Regards,
Baldur
On Fri, Aug 2, 2019 at 5:32 PM JORDI PALET MARTINEZ
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
I understand that, but the inconvenient is the fix allocation of
ports per client, and not all the clients use the same number of
ports. Every option has good and bad things.
MAP is less efficient in terms of maximizing the “use” of the
existing IPv4 addresses.
https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-lmhp-v6ops-transition-comparison/
Regards,
Jordi
@jordipalet
El 2/8/19 17:25, "NANOG en nombre de Baldur Norddahl"
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> en
nombre de [email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> escribió:
Hi Jordi
My alternative to MAP-E is plain old NAT 444 dual stack. I am
trying to avoid the expense and operative nightmare of having to
run a redundant NAT server setup with thousands of users. MAP is
the only alternative that avoids a provider run NAT server.
Regards,
Baldur
On Fri, Aug 2, 2019 at 3:38 PM JORDI PALET MARTINEZ via NANOG
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote:
Ask the vendor to support RFC8585.
Also, you can do it with OpenWRT.
I think 464XLAT is a better option and both of them are
supported by OpenWRT.
You can also use OpenSource (Jool) for the NAT64.
Regards,
Jordi
@jordipalet
El 2/8/19 14:20, "NANOG en nombre de Baldur Norddahl"
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> en
nombre de [email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>> escribió:
Hello
Are there any known public deployments of MAP-E? What about
CPE routers with support?
The pricing on IPv4 is now at USD 20/address so I am thinking
we are forced to go the CGN route going forward. Of all the
options, MAP-E appears to be the most elegant. Just add/remove
some more headers on a packet and route it as normal. No need
to invest in anything as our core routers can already do that.
No worries about scale.
BUT - our current CPE has zero support. We are too small that
they will make this feature just for us, so I need to convince
them there is going to be a demand. Alternatively I need to
find a different CPE vendor that has MAP-E support, but are
there any?
What is holding MAP-E back? In my view MAP-E could be the end
game for IPv4. Customers get full IPv6 and enough of IPv4 to
be somewhat compatible. The ISP networks are not forced to do
a lot of processing such as CGN otherwise requires.
I read some posts from Japan where users are reporting a
deployment of MAP-E. Anyone know about that?
Regards,
Baldur
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