>> #5 - why would they want to work under Nebula? No offense meant here either, but there is a cost to working under this umbrella and the benefits don't seem especially well laid out... I'm really not sure what they are even. Overall, I've had a better experience with code at Sourceforge and have reopened development of CDateTime there (where it began) - I plan on reconnecting with Peter and seeing what I can transfer over, but for my development SF is good and, most importantly, widgets are fun again.<<
The main reasons to stay at Eclipse IMO are: 1) (If we can actually ship a real build,) you get more visibility for your work. 2) Companies that rely on the Eclipse IP process will trust you. 3) Eclipse keeps track of the ongoing IP book keeping as long as you keep things up to date. Dave Orme On Tue, Jun 17, 2008 at 4:49 PM, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Send nebula-dev mailing list submissions to > [email protected] > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/nebula-dev > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > You can reach the person managing the list at > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of nebula-dev digest..." > > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: CTableTree (Jeremy Dowdall) > 2. Re: CTableTree (Tom Schindl) > 3. Re: CTableTree (Emil Crumhorn) > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Message: 1 > Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2008 10:28:50 -0600 > From: "Jeremy Dowdall" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Re: [nebula-dev] CTableTree > To: "Nebula Dev" <[email protected]> > Message-ID: > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Hi All, > > I agree with Emil - great email Tom; this is stuff that would be of great > benefit to Nebula. > Also, no offense taken, but thanks for your concern (assuming that was for > my benefit, being the author of CTableTree and the original author of > CDateTime). > > Some thoughts: > #1 - it could also be helpful to work in some information about supported > platforms: > Dormant: CTableTree - Win32 > Sandbox: CTabeTree - GTK > Rebuilding the CTableTree for win32 really took all the fun out of the > project (for me) - looking back, had I just focused on gtk I probably > would've had more to hand off to the next interested party. Also, people > coming to the project would have a better understanding of what to expect > and where to begin. > > #2 - perhaps a main contact and then a list of other developers and their > areas of specialty (if applicable) > > #3 - a common release could also help bring the members of Nebula together > - > each widget really is a separate project, but the lack of cross-over > efforts > has always been disappointing. People are busy but generall want to help > out, so any bits of infrastructure that promote working together would be > great - perhaps a common goal would be a good starting point? > > #4 - I think transfer of ownership should give the original author 1st > right > of refusal, but should err on the side of the code's vitality - meaning, if > I can't be reached for a reasonable amount of time, then whoever wants to > work on CTableTree should be able to keep the code alive; if for some > reason, however, someone wants to take over the code while I'm working on > it > they wouldn't be allowed without some sort of due process. > > #5 - why would they want to work under Nebula? No offense meant here > either, but there is a cost to working under this umbrella and the benefits > don't seem especially well laid out... I'm really not sure what they are > even. Overall, I've had a better experience with code at Sourceforge and > have reopened development of CDateTime there (where it began) - I plan on > reconnecting with Peter and seeing what I can transfer over, but for my > development SF is good and, most importantly, widgets are fun again. > > anyway, just some thoughts > > cheers, > jeremy > > > On Tue, Jun 17, 2008 at 1:43 AM, Emil Crumhorn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > Good email Tom. > > > > Allow me to fill in that list slightly: > > > > CollapisbleButtons - Emil Crumhorn > > CalendarCombo - Emil Crumhorn > > GanttChart - Emil Crumhorn > > > > As far as 1.0 goes or Sandbox, The GanttChart is by far ready for a > proper > > 1.0 release (of my current 2.0 "alpha" release). There are quite a few > > people using it in production environments and I have basically zero bugs > > filed against it. People seem quite happy with it and most emails I get > is > > people asking about extending or customizing. > > > > The other two widgets can wait. CalendarCombo is currently broken on GTK > > with no fix in sight due to listeners not firing where they should, and I > > just heard yesterday about some issues on latest OS/X as well (which > makes > > me wonder if it's the same issues). I haven't had time to check that yet. > > CollapsibleButtons is stable as far as the widget goes, but it needs some > > better layout handling, as currently it's a bit of a chore to "push it > into > > place", there's also a bug or two filed against it. > > > > Speaking of NattTable, I checked it out, and it is a cool project. Due to > > needing a production table right away I went with KTable + Glazed Lists, > > which is an amazing combination, Glazed Lists are cooler than cool in my > > book and work without a hitch: http://publicobject.com/glazedlists/ .. I > > would love to see the Grid using an implementation of that for example, > for > > sorting / filtering etc. KTable itself has some issues, but for what we > > needed it's ok plus GlazedLists came with example models for using > KTable. > > > > It seems many table-widgets are somewhere inbetween usable and > problematic, > > I truly hope one project can ride out the storm as a fast and stable > > Table-widget replacement would be a very nice welcome to pretty much all > my > > projects. > > > > Emil > > > > > > On Tue, Jun 17, 2008 at 9:27 AM, Tom Schindl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > wrote: > > > >> Hi, > >> > >> This pops up a question. > >> > >> 1. Do we need project states > >> ---------------------------- > >> Do we need something like a dormant state for our projects to indicate > >> that there's currently no active committer working on them. > >> > >> I think nebula is structured like the Apache Commons Project which has > to > >> following sub-project structure: > >> > >> * The Commons Proper - A repository of reusable Java components. > >> * The Commons Sandbox - A workspace for Java component development. > >> * The Commons Dormant - A repository of Sandbox components that are > >> currently inactive. > >> > >> This is no offense to anybody but it would make the situation clear to > >> everybody outside. > >> > >> Looking at the current Widgets I'd structure them the following: > >> - Dormant: CTableTree > >> - Proper: *needs at least a 1.0 release* > >> - Sandbox: CompositeTable, CDateTime, FormattedText, Gallery, Grid, > >> PGroup, PShelf, CollapsibleButtons, GanttChart > >> > >> Components I'm uncertain about are: > >> DateChooser, DateChooserCombo, CalendarCombo > >> > >> > >> 2. Can we maintain somewhere who is responsible for which widget? > >> ----------------------------------------------------------------- > >> I currently did find a list who is responsible for what. The only > resource > >> I found to get this information from are the cvs commits. > >> > >> PShelf - Chris Gross > >> PGroup - Chris Gross > >> Gallery & GalleryViewer - Nicolas Richeton > >> Grid & GridViewer - Chris Gross & Tom Schindl (if vote succeeds) > >> CTableTree - noone => dormant > >> CompositeTable - David Orme > >> CDateTime - Peter Centraf > >> FormattedText - ? > >> CollapsibleButtons - ? > >> GanttChart - ? > >> DateChooser - ? > >> DateChooserCombo - ? > >> CalendarCombo - ? > >> > >> 3. Can we try to get a release out of the door > >> ---------------------------------------------- > >> Often people come up and say they won't use Nebula-Widgets because they > >> are not having had a 1.0 release are marked as Alpha. This situation is > not > >> ideal because some of them are as stable as any other SWT-Widget is. > >> > >> I think the following components are ready for a 1.0 release: > >> - PShelf > >> - PGroup > >> - Gallery (Nicolas?) > >> > >> The following ones are not far away from 1.0 release: > >> - Grid & GridViewer > >> > >> 4. How to move widget-owner-ship if original author is not reachable > >> -------------------------------------------------------------------- > >> CTreeTable is an example for a situation that can happen (once more this > >> not offense) to any of the widget. The author moves on and after some > time > >> another person from the community pops up and what's to work on the > code. > >> How do we decided to give ownership to someone different without the > >> feedback from the original author? > >> > >> Peter there was someone mailing me privately today about a problem with > >> CDateTime and Vista. Did you see this one? > >> > >> 5. A cool new nebula component would be: > >> ---------------------------------------- > >> http://sourceforge.net/projects/nattable/. I know once more a Grid like > >> implementation but maybe we can convince them to do their development > under > >> the umbrella of nebula and eclipse. > >> > >> I hope this mail is not too long and you all read through it until here. > >> Thanks for your feedback. > >> > >> Tom > >> > >> Peter Centgraf schrieb: > >> > >>> The original author of CTableTree and CDateTime hasn't been around to > >>> maintain them for a couple of years now. He handed off CDateTime to > me, but > >>> I don't think anyone is maintaining CTableTree aka CTree. If you want > to > >>> take over the project, I don't think anyone would object. The code is > >>> available in CVS in the Technology Project repository, as you can see > here: > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> > http://dev.eclipse.org/viewcvs/index.cgi/org.eclipse.swt.nebula/org.eclipse.nebula.widgets.ctree/?root=Technology_Project > >>> > >>> > >>> -- > >>> > >>> Peter > >>> > >>> > >>> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >>> > >>> *From:* [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto: > >>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] *On Behalf Of *Healy, Dan J. > >>> *Sent:* Thursday, June 12, 2008 12:27 PM > >>> *To:* [email protected] > >>> *Subject:* [nebula-dev] CTableTree > >>> > >>> > >>> Hi all, > >>> > >>> > >>> What is the current status of the CTableTree? I saw a few > conversations > >>> about it being converted to CTree, but I see that the Nebula project > still > >>> has CTableTree on the home page. I'm just as happy with that, as I am > able > >>> to get the .jar file to work for me, but I'm not able to find the > source in > >>> the CTableTree download, or in CVS. > >>> > >>> I'd be fine with the CTableTree, if I could find the source and fix up > >>> the presentation a bit. Or, if there's a component page for CTree that > I'm > >>> just not seeing a link to, I could probably work with that. > >>> > >>> Regards, > >>> > >>> -dan healy > >>> > >>> > >>> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >>> > >>> _______________________________________________ > >>> nebula-dev mailing list > >>> [email protected] > >>> https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/nebula-dev > >>> > >> > >> _______________________________________________ > >> nebula-dev mailing list > >> [email protected] > >> https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/nebula-dev > >> > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Emil Crumhorn - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Senior Software Engineer > > http://www.hexapixel.com/ > > _______________________________________________ > > nebula-dev mailing list > > [email protected] > > https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/nebula-dev > > > > > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/private/nebula-dev/attachments/20080617/b2d86169/attachment.html > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 2 > Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2008 20:25:09 +0200 > From: Tom Schindl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Re: [nebula-dev] CTableTree > To: Nebula Dev <[email protected]> > Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed > > Hi Jeremy, > > I'll comment on the other points later > > [...] > > #5 - why would they want to work under Nebula? No offense meant here > > either, but there is a cost to working under this umbrella and the > > benefits don't seem especially well laid out... I'm really not sure what > > they are even. Overall, I've had a better experience with code at > > Sourceforge and have reopened development of CDateTime there (where it > > began) - I plan on reconnecting with Peter and seeing what I can > > transfer over, but for my development SF is good and, most importantly, > > widgets are fun again. > > What makes working under nebula different from working on sourceforge? > > After you have done to initial stuff (signed committer agreement, ...) > there's no limiting thing in nebula as far as I can see but on the other > hand you can reach many developers because your control is part of > eclipse (and advertised on the website). > > Would anybody of you ever heard of the cool widgets if they are not part > of nebula? I always thought the purpose for the creation of the > Nebula-Project was to provide a central platform for widget creators to > have a place people can look for additional widgets. > > If there's something that holds off people from making the widget part > of nebula I think there needs to get a bug filed and fixed immediately ;-) > > Tom > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 3 > Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2008 23:49:41 +0200 > From: "Emil Crumhorn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Re: [nebula-dev] CTableTree > To: "Nebula Dev" <[email protected]> > Message-ID: > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Personally my biggest "issue" is that Nightly builds aren't working (which > I've voiced over and over and asked about without any answers). It seems if > one "widget" has bad code, the entire build for Nebula fails (I'm not sure > that's 100% correct, but from some old email thread that seems to be the > case). I'm not sure who gets notified, but it doesn't seem to be the widget > owner. From what I can see, the last nightly build ran on February 11th at > 3:01 AM... I haven't heard anything of why they don't work, and neither do > I > know the inner workings of the Eclipse build process nor seem to have any > access to it through the Eclipse portal. > > I re-linked all my widget download links to my own server where I set up a > nightly build process, just so that those that don't want to check > everything out of CVS all the time to get the latest code, can download the > latest jars/javadocs/etc, but I'm sure there's many that don't have the > option of doing something similar. It'd be nice to know what's going on > with > the builds and to get them up and running, and even better, to have a build > run on each widget seperately so if one repo has code that won't compile, > it > doesn't affect everyone else. > > Emil > > On Tue, Jun 17, 2008 at 8:25 PM, Tom Schindl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > Hi Jeremy, > > > > I'll comment on the other points later > > > > [...] > > > >> #5 - why would they want to work under Nebula? No offense meant here > >> either, but there is a cost to working under this umbrella and the > benefits > >> don't seem especially well laid out... I'm really not sure what they are > >> even. Overall, I've had a better experience with code at Sourceforge > and > >> have reopened development of CDateTime there (where it began) - I plan > on > >> reconnecting with Peter and seeing what I can transfer over, but for my > >> development SF is good and, most importantly, widgets are fun again. > >> > > > > What makes working under nebula different from working on sourceforge? > > > > After you have done to initial stuff (signed committer agreement, ...) > > there's no limiting thing in nebula as far as I can see but on the other > > hand you can reach many developers because your control is part of > eclipse > > (and advertised on the website). > > > > Would anybody of you ever heard of the cool widgets if they are not part > of > > nebula? I always thought the purpose for the creation of the > Nebula-Project > > was to provide a central platform for widget creators to have a place > people > > can look for additional widgets. > > > > If there's something that holds off people from making the widget part of > > nebula I think there needs to get a bug filed and fixed immediately ;-) > > > > Tom > > > > _______________________________________________ > > nebula-dev mailing list > > [email protected] > > https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/nebula-dev > > > > > > -- > > Emil Crumhorn - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Senior Software Engineer > http://www.hexapixel.com/ > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: > https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/private/nebula-dev/attachments/20080617/d3780eba/attachment.html > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > nebula-dev mailing list > [email protected] > https://dev.eclipse.org/mailman/listinfo/nebula-dev > > > End of nebula-dev Digest, Vol 26, Issue 8 > ***************************************** >
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