>Security by obscurity is bad, but so is "spoon feeding".  Learn for the
>sake of learning -- gather knowledge and improve yourself.  If you run
>into a brick wall, try and chisel through it before asking someone else
>to do it for you.

Yes, learning by practice is great. Except if we all did that, we'd have no 
need for the mailing list. Maybe I'm wrong, but the mailing list is for 
questions...even if they're stupid.

On top of that, some of us don't have the time to expend learning everything 
we want to. As it is, I already work 50-60 hours a week and sometimes I ask 
really stupid simple questions just because I don't have even the 10 minutes, 
when I need it, to figure it out myself. And it doesn't apply to this 
question, but sometimes it's better to ask than to play with something if 
you're unsure if you can "put it back together" yourself - say, when your 
company's primary money making database is FUBAR'ed, you have to fix it, and 
you have only the next hour to do so. It's often NOT the best time to play 
around.

>Oh well.. just my opinion and I am sure I will be blasted for it, for
>one simple reason -- it goes against what the script-kiddies believe.
>They use the "security by obscurity" as a smoke screen to blame us,
>instead of themselves...

Well, I didn't follow this whole thread, but at one time *I* asked how to do 
the same thing. I certainly don't consider myself a script kiddie, if only 
because securing my company's servers is part of my job description.

Rob Nelson
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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