On Wed, 21 Jul 2004 07:13:33 -0400, Lanman wrote > Scott Mazur wrote: > > On Mon, 19 Jul 2004 21:19:19 -0400, Lanman wrote > > > >>Can someone provide info regarding switching from XFree86 to Xorg? > >>I've been trying for day to get it working properly, and I'm still stumped. > >>I'm running an ATI Radeon 9200SE AGP video card with 128MB onboard ram. > >>XFree86 is installed and running, but I can't find the DRI module > >>anywhere. It seems that without that module, I'm not going to get > >>OpenGL to work. > >> > >>At the same time, Xorg running on another box, driving an NVidia > >>card is detecting the card properly and loading the proper OpenGL > >>driver module. Even so, Xorg refuses to give me OpenGL on the ATI > >>card, and the drivers at ATI's site don't seem to be usable with > >>XFree86-4.4.0 . > >> > >>Which version of which system should I be running on mandrake 10.0 > >>Official that will allow me to finally get OpenGL working? Also, if > >>I migrate to Xorg, is there a new config file to set up, and if so, > >> what's the procedure? > >> > >>I'm getting a little peeved at running a Vesa module for this card, > >> and any help would be greatly appreciated. My eyes are turning into > >>little brown wrinkled raisins! > >> > >>Lanman > > > > > > I have exactly that same card running under Xorg, with fully functioning > > acceleration. Switching to Xorg is a no brainer. Just install Xorg. I > > believe it replaces Xfree86 and creates links to the config file (uses the > > exact same config file, no changes). When you reboot, your x logs will look > > exactly the same, only you'll see Xorg, where you might have seen Xfree86. > > No extra kernel modules, no ATI kernels, no ATI drivers. Just stock MDK > > 10.0. Seems to me, the motherboard chipset may ultimately be a factor as > > different agp modules are needed for each (which has nothing to do with your > > ATI card), so your mileage may vary... > > > > Scott > > Scott; Thanks for the reply. Switching to Xorg didn't cut it at this > end and I'm back to XFree86 and a basic (vesa) driver. SiS chipset > on the board is detected and proper modules for it are loaded with > no problems, but still No Joy on the ATI card. > > I've noticed that XFree86 doesn't get un-installed during install of > Xorg, and due to that, I can still recover to XFree86 when Xorg > coughs up a big wet nasty hairball. > > The transition to Xorg (IMHO) isn't all it's cracked up to be, since > it seems to be incomplete. So far, Mandrake Control Center doesn't > see Xorg, or provide a GUI to configure it, and it probably won't > change that until Mandrake makes a point of dropping Xfree86, and > revising their tools for Xorg. > > I hear that this is in the works with most of the major distro's, > and some have already made the switch, but Mandrake's not there yet.
Actually, MCC handles Xorg just fine, since it uses the same config file and format. The only thing that would make the switch total is changing the text wording from Xfree86 to Xorg. It's probably a good idea to keep the Xorg and Xfree86 config files linked as there will likely be users using both for some reason or another for a long time to come. Just like keeping /etc/modprobe.conf and /etc/modules.conf in sync (kernel 2.6 and 2.4 formats) even if you're only running one or the other kernel. > I don't know how you managed to get Acceleration working without the > driver modules from ATI, but then again, it wouldn't surprise me, > since Xorg still has a bit of mystery about it, as far as I'm > concerned. For instance, why write the output of "xorgconfig" to the > "xorg.conf" if xorg is using the XF86Config-4 file? Why even mention > it? It sounds like it's going to write the output to the file, and > then you'll have to find out how to launch Xorg differently than how > you launch XFree86. Well, technically, xorg isn't using XF86Config-4, it's using xorg.conf and if xorg is all you have installed then that's all it has to use. But since xorg (the mandrake rpm at least) is designed to work along side an existing Xfree86 setup, xorg.conf is a link to XF86Config-4 so both xorg and Xfree86 share the same config file. When the decision is made to officially drop XFree86 for good, then xorg.conf will become the main file and the XFree86 package (should you decide to install it) will probably be designed to link off the xorg config file rather than how it's done today. It's different, but once the initial shock wears off, it makes good sense :) > The Q&A section of xorgconfig (which by the way did not identify my > card properly) seems to skip past a few points which it says it > wants to ask you about, and it moves on to the next section as if > those questions never existed. I never used the xorgconfig command (never used the Xfree86 equivalent tool either). Just set things up through the MCC GUI tool. > Now for the weird part. I had to run some tests on another distro > (Fedora Core 2),the other day and during the start of the install it > specifically identify my monitor and my video card right down to the > model number, something that Mandrake has never done. Fedora Core 2 > runs on Xorg. There is no XFree86 on the distro. Acceleration wasn't > there, and I wasn't sure if I could use the ATI RPM to add > Acceleration, since their rpms are for specific versions of XFree86, > but their was definitely an improvement in graphic quality. > > So, there's obviously a bit of work that needs to be done by > Mandrake regarding Xorg, but we won't see the results until they > merge it into the distro, and toast XFree86 completely. I'll be glad > when that happens. > > I'm glad that Charle's RPM's worked for you, but as you say, there > could be differences in how Xorg works with an SiS chipset and its > AGP driver module compared to your board. In the meantime, I'm back > into a desktop running XFree86, sigh. Well, XFree86 will probably not be toasted complelety for a long time (even if version updates cease). I'm sure there's a world of installed systems that just won't see a need to switch. I feel your pain though. I've got an older ATI radeon all-in-wonder card that crashes hard every time I try to run acceleration on (Xorg doesn't appear to be cure). Each new version of Linux holds the promise of solving the problem, but sometimes more things break then get fixed. I find this whole bit about motherboard chipsets is particularily frustrating. Even if you have a supported piece of hardware (like say the ATI 9200SE) with up to date drivers, you're not guaranteed to get it working because of one (totally undocumented) quirk or another on the mother board. There's a whole layer of hardware interfacing code that just seems to be shooting in the dark sometimes. You'd think there would be code standards for interfacing to PCI/AGP cards that every mother board must conform to. I can't believe the mother board manufactures are breaking the rules (or their hardware just wouldn't work/sell). So that leaves me with the conclusion that the Linux code doesn't conform to all the interfacing rules. Or as in the boot sector problem reported not that long ago, maybe Linux conforms to the interfacing rules too well. Scott -- Nothing goes to waste when Little Fish are near! (http://www.littlefish.ca)
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