> -----Original Message-----
> From: Michel Clasquin [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
> Sent: Monday, June 25, 2001 3:22 PM
> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Subject: Re: [newbie] Your article is premature in articel
>
>
> Hmm, that's a funny name for a thread ...
>
> On Monday 25 June 2001 16:51, Mark Johnson wrote:
> > Let me play devil's advocate: Does the desktop even have a
> chance in linux?
>
> First of all, "the desktop" is rarely defined by all the
> people who raise
> this issue. At which point does a "business desktop" shade off into a
> "workstation"? Is a "SOHO desktop" the same thing as a
> "corporate desktop"?
> And is there such a thing as a "home desktop"? Until all
> these categories are
> cleared up, we might just be shouting past each other.
>
Yup. What is the desktop? Is it StarOffice, or a suite of applications
comparable to what MS Office brings you, or something else? I don't know, I
guess to me it would be what a client/customer thinks a desktop means.
You're right, it probably means something different depending on the
context. Do you think most folks (Linux, Mac, Windows users) think of the
desktop as productivity apps like full featured Email, Word Processor,
Spreadsheet, Presentation, Financials application, and integrated web
browser. I'm willing to be yes. Has MS already defined the "Desktop" in the
minds of most computer users? A desktop for me means a console, web browser,
and an IDE, but I don't think this constitutes a desktop in the common
venacular.
> > The reason I ask this is because I wonder how many of us really use
> > office-type products. I might fire up Word here at work
> because I have to
> > write some documentation, and I might dabble in Excel to
> manipulate some
> > data. The biggest office product that I spend most of my
> "office" time in
> > is Visio and Powerpoint for drawing concepts for meetings.
>
> WordPerfect is the big one for me. I use a spreadsheet once a
> year and I've
> never made a presentation in my life. Yes, I mean that -
> where I live, we
> still know how to run meetings without pretty pictures. So
> that brings us
> back to my question. Are you and I talking about the same
> thing when we
> pontificate about "the desktop"?
>
Yeah, your right and this was my point in my original post what you and me
consider a desktop is probably quite different than what a typical Mac and
Window user considers a desktop. What kinds of things are those folks
expecting? Is linux willing to entertain those expectations or are we going
to call their expectations stupid and deprecate the user calling him or her
numbskull....
> > If I had to guess the Linux user community is really
> comprised sysadmins & developers (C/C++/PERL/PHP/PYTHON/WEB/etc..). Those
folks
> typically don't do a lot of office type tasks and if they have to write
> something down it is usually via an ASCII text file or some minimal HMTL.
>
> And the rest of us could learn something from them! But I think your
> characterisation of the community is a little dated. it was
> like that even 2 years ago, but increasingly all sorts of people are
> installing Linux now that it installs on average hardware without any
tech-Voodoo being
> required.
>
I hope it is dated, but I don' t know any linux user that isn't either a
developer or sysadmin -- I'm sure I need to get out more.. :)
> > I'm not too sure that the interest in a general desktop for
> Joe user is
> Sorry to sound like a stuck record, but again, if you can
> actually define who Joe User is and what he needs or wants to do with a
computer,
> you'll have made a big step forwards. Is he related to Joe Sixpack, btw?
>
Yeah, I think so. My definition of Joe User is the dreaded AOL user (the
arch enemy of Linux and the contaminator of all that is pure and holy).
> > broad enough to see a significant evolution in the liunx
> desktop. One person mentioned that by verison 10 or 11 Mandrake will be
> there -- I really, really hope that is the case -- but honestly I am
> skeptical; I think it will be longer.
>
> I think it is there already. All that is needed is the preloads.
>
Yeah, probably - but here at my office if I say "it's done. All that is
needed is.." My manager will stamp NOT DONE across my forehead before I can
finish the sentence and tell me to get back to work. I think this is a
common perspective for linux outsiders...
> >I don't think the community at large feels the
> > urgency to make linux viable for the desktop
>
> Then why does the subject come up so regularly?
>
Squeaky wheels?
> > Is "Linux on the Desktop" a political battle between us an
> Microsoft, or is
> > it simply a technical challenge we place on ourselves to
> see how much fun
> > we can have?
>
> Get organised and incorporated to battle the monster of
> Redmond, and it will
> crush you. Have fun, and you may simply outlast it. It seems
> to have worked
> so far ...
>
agreed.
