Seriously?
Do you know what a unit test is?
Have you ever used a real refactoring tool (like R#)?
Do you understand what Configuration.BuildSessionFactory does?
Diego
On Thu, Aug 12, 2010 at 22:51, Vadim Chekan <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Aug 12, 3:27 pm, José F. Romaniello <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > You can change XML easily, and if you do the things right (write unit
> > tests), you are safe.
>
> If it is a blogging app, may be. But enterprise app can have 400
> tables easily. I would rather quit then "easily" edit this xml.
>
> Imagine you decided to change naming schema. With c# attribute based
> config you edit name in the code and mapped name is right in the line
> above.
> With programmatic mapping even better, you use refactoring tools.
> With xml you have to switch to xml, find, edit, switch back. Do it
> couple hundreds of times, and call it "easy" :) Ah, wait, error ratio
> in so boring job is high, so there will be bugs. Test it, find bugs,
> troubleshoot, fix, test again. How 'easy" is it?
>
> > If you made the things wrong, you are not safe even with FNH. I am
> talking
> > about crud FNH not automappings, that may be another thing.
> > Static languages generate a false sense of safety.
>
> Static check is safer then dynamic error. What can be even discussed
> here?
>
> > FNH maybe has an advantage when you write from scratch, having
> intellisense
> > is really good. So, I maintain my position, do you?
>
> I'd say it is the least concern. Xml can have intellisence based on
> schema too. My concern is dynamic development with many changes to DB.
> I want to minimize time I spent editing mappings and minimize risks.
>
> Vadim.
>
> > 2010/8/12 Tuna Toksoz <[email protected]>
> >
> > > You can change it more easily than you could with XML.
> >
> > > Tuna Toksöz
> > > Eternal sunshine of the open source mind.
> >
> > >http://devlicio.us/blogs/tuna_toksoz
> > >http://tunatoksoz.com
> > >http://twitter.com/tehlike
> >
> > > On Fri, Aug 13, 2010 at 1:06 AM, José F. Romaniello <
> > > [email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > >> define "editable"
> >
> > >> 2010/8/12 Tuna Toksoz <[email protected]>
> >
> > >>> I agree with John, and will like to add that I don't see the point of
> a
> > >>>> tool generating code for another tool that generates code.
> >
> > >>> I do see value in that. FNH is much more readable and editable than
> > >>> ordinary XML.
> >
> > >>>> Is like if the FNH team choose to generate LLLBlGen Pro dsl.
> > >>>> I hope this will be taken as a constructive comment.
> >
> > >>>> XML in his both representations as raw XML or as HBM* classes is the
> > >>>> lowest common denominator.
> > >>>> See? I read Fabio's blog.
> >
> > >>>> 2010/8/12 John Davidson <[email protected]>
> >
> > >>>> Frans,
> >
> > >>>>> Fleunt NHibernate is almost a non-starter as there is no
> documentation
> > >>>>> on how to use it with VB.Net, if it would even work. XML is a
> lowest common
> > >>>>> denominator type solution and should always be retained. Higher
> level
> > >>>>> solutions are great, but not always accessible
> >
> > >>>>> John Davidson
> >
> > >>>>> On Thu, Aug 12, 2010 at 12:51 PM, Frans Bouma <[email protected]> wrote:
> >
> > >>>>>> > Same XML please.
> >
> > >>>>>> that's trivial if I define the model like you did in code.
> >
> > >>>>>> > btw Frans, you product is a code generator I can't skip 42
> slides
> > >>>>>> because
> > >>>>>> in
> > >>>>>> > the early slides you are describing the domain relations and
> > >>>>>> relational
> > >>>>>> > mapping...
> >
> > >>>>>> no, not the mapping, just the entities and the
> relationships.
> > >>>>>> I
> > >>>>>> don't define any mapping in that video by hand, nor the DDL SQL.
> > >>>>>> Mappings +
> > >>>>>> table stuff is created by 1 mouseclick using settings to configure
> > >>>>>> what will
> > >>>>>> I end up with.
> >
> > >>>>>> > would be the same than explain that you have a whole application
> > >>>>>> running
> > >>>>>> > starting from "press F5".
> >
> > >>>>>> you wrote classes to start with, I didn't. The classes
> contain
> > >>>>>> the
> > >>>>>> info used by confORM, I created a model, which produces classes +
> > >>>>>> mappings +
> > >>>>>> DDL SQL, using very few keystrokes btw.
> >
> > >>>>>> But, like I said, let's not end up in a pissing contest :)
> > >>>>>> Being in
> > >>>>>> a rush to get things done a.s.a.p. is never going to end well, so
> > >>>>>> that's not
> > >>>>>> what people should focus on. It's about maintainability etc., and
> > >>>>>> confORM
> > >>>>>> could be a good choice for that as well, I don't want to have that
> > >>>>>> debate,
> > >>>>>> as it's besides the point. The point is: with all the options, is
> yet
> > >>>>>> another option from the team around NH really helping, or just
> > >>>>>> confusing
> > >>>>>> users?
> >
> > >>>>>> Also, is it or isn't it the future _preferred_ way of doing
> NH
> > >>>>>> mappings from the point of view of the NH team? (so others have to
> > >>>>>> adapt to
> > >>>>>> confORM, and if they want support xml as well, but that's really
> not
> > >>>>>> the way
> > >>>>>> to go)
> >
> > >>>>>> FB
> >
> > >>>>>> > On Thu, Aug 12, 2010 at 1:11 PM, Frans Bouma <[email protected]>
> wrote:
> >
> > >>>>>> > > Now that you saw something more about ConfORM I will
> happy
> > >>>>>> if you
> > >>>>>> > can
> > >>>>>> > answer
> > >>>>>> > > my annoying question.
> > >>>>>> > > Can you show me the equivalent-mapping/procedure using
> what
> > >>>>>> ever
> > >>>>>> > you want
> > >>>>>> > ?
> >
> > >>>>>> > (it's an old video of the alpha build, I'll soon
> make a
> > >>>>>> new,
> > >>>>>> > more
> > >>>>>> > extensive one with quickmodel and NH. It's for our own
> > >>>>>> framework,
> > >>>>>> but
> > >>>>>> > choosing NH is 2 clicks)
> >
> > >>>>>>
> http://www.xs4all.nl/~perseus/LLBLGenPro/Videos/LLBLGenProv3.0_QuickM
> > >>>>>> > odel.ht
> > >>>>>> > ml
> >
> > >>>>>> <
> > >>>>>>
> http://www.xs4all.nl/~perseus/LLBLGenPro/Videos/LLBLGenProv3.0_QuickM...
> > >>>>>> > t ml>
> >
> > >>>>>> > skip to slide 42, press play
> >
> > >>>>>> > I know, you start with code, I with the model, same
> > >>>>>> thing.
> >
> > >>>>>> > FB
> >
> > >>>>>> > > Thanks.
> >
> > >>>>>> > > On Thu, Aug 12, 2010 at 12:34 PM, Fabio Maulo
> > >>>>>> > <[email protected]>
> > >>>>>> > wrote:
> >
> > >>>>>> > > On Thu, Aug 12, 2010 at 11:43 AM, Tom Allard
> > >>>>>> > <[email protected]>
> > >>>>>> > > wrote:
> >
> > >>>>>> > > "Make everything as simple as possible,
> but
> > >>>>>> not
> > >>>>>> > simpler."
> > >>>>>> > > -- Albert Einstein
> >
> > >>>>>> > > Sure.
> > >>>>>> > > For that reason this ConfORM mapping
> >
> > >>>>>> > > var orm = new ObjectRelationalMapper();
> >
> > >>>>>> > > orm.TablePerClass<Animal>();
> >
> > >>>>>> > > orm.TablePerClass<User>();
> > >>>>>> > > orm.TablePerClass<StateProvince>();
> > >>>>>> > > orm.TablePerClassHierarchy<Zoo>();
> >
> > >>>>>> > > orm.ManyToMany<Human, Human>();
> > >>>>>> > > orm.OneToOne<User, Human>();
> >
> > >>>>>> > > orm.PoidStrategies.Add(new NativePoidPattern());
> > >>>>>> > > is equivalent to this XML mapping
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <hibernate-mapping
> > >>>>>> > xmlns:xsi="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema-
> > >>>>>> > > instance"
> >
> > >>>>>> xmlns:xsd="http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema";
> >
> > >>>>>> > > namespace="ConfOrmExample.Domain"
> > >>>>>> > > assembly="ConfOrmExample"
> >
> > >>>>>> > >
> xmlns="urn:nhibernate-mapping-2.2">
> > >>>>>> > > <class name="User">
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <id name="Id" type="Int64">
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <generator class="native" />
> >
> > >>>>>> > > </id>
> > >>>>>> > > <property name="UserName" />
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <one-to-one name="Human" />
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <list name="Permissions">
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <key column="user_key" />
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <list-index />
> > >>>>>> > > <element type="String" />
> >
> > >>>>>> > > </list>
> > >>>>>> > > </class>
> > >>>>>> > > <class name="Animal">
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <id name="Id" type="Int64">
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <generator class="native" />
> >
> > >>>>>> > > </id>
> > >>>>>> > > <property name="BodyWeight" />
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <set name="Offspring" inverse="true"
> > >>>>>> > cascade="all,delete-
> > >>>>>> > > orphan">
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <key column="Mother" />
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <one-to-many class="Animal" />
> >
> > >>>>>> > > </set>
> > >>>>>> > > <many-to-one name="Mother" cascade="all" />
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <many-to-one name="Father" cascade="all" />
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <property name="Description" />
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <many-to-one name="Zoo" />
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <property name="SerialNumber" />
> >
> > >>>>>> > > </class>
> > >>>>>> > > <class name="StateProvince">
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <id name="Id" type="Int64">
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <generator class="native" />
> >
> > >>>>>> > > </id>
> > >>>>>> > > <property name="Name" />
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <property name="IsoCode" />
> >
> > >>>>>> > > </class>
> > >>>>>> > > <class name="Zoo">
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <id name="Id" type="Int64">
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <generator class="native" />
> >
> > >>>>>> > > </id>
> > >>>>>> > > <discriminator />
> > >>>>>> > > <property name="Name" />
> >
> > >>>>>> > > <property name="Classification" />
> >
> > ...
> >
> > read more »
>
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