Ahh…so if servers aren’t identical then you have to use a different session broker for each group. That article (I didn’t read it all until about an hour ago) was quite insightful and I see TS is aimed at smaller shops like mine. Good to know that if I want to scale outward very much that XenApp is something to be seriously considered, especially in high availability and management.
I also just looked at the 2008 R2 changes from straight 2008 (http://www.microsoft.com/windowsserver2008/en/us/whats-new.aspx) and don’t see any Terminal Server changes. Dave From: Tom Miller [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Friday, October 29, 2010 1:33 PM To: NT System Admin Issues Subject: RE: Citrix or Windows Terminal Server? Okay I understand you. Yes, your definition is correct. On XenApp servers though, a farm is your collection of servers. Some may have one app, others different applications. Or you can have multiple farms to keep admin/availability separate. It's based on preference and politics. I have one farm but apps on different servers. As for your TS machines, I cannot speak to R2, so it might be different in that version. In 2008 you want to have all apps installed on all terminal servers. This is because the session broker routes to any server, and you cannot define which servers are to be used for particular applications. Perhaps someone on the list with R2 can confirm/correct me here. Tom >>> David Lum <[email protected]> 10/29/2010 3:55 PM >>> That’s verbatim from the link Webster provided. By silo, do you mean say 3 servers with apps A,B and C, 2 servers with D and E? Can’t you do that with TS servers? You’d just have 2 TS farms right and they wouldn’t necessarily need to know the other farm exists so it wouldn’t matter that the 2 servers aren’t identical to the two others. I’m obviously missing something here… I have 3 TS machines here – not in a farm yet – and two are identical to each other and the 3rd is completely different, so the different one probably can’t be part of a farm that the other two are in, right? Dave From: Tom Miller [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Friday, October 29, 2010 12:36 PM To: NT System Admin Issues Subject: RE: Citrix or Windows Terminal Server? Where is that from? That's a bit confusing. Is that saying you can or cannot silo your applications in Terminal Server 2008? Don't know about R2. Is that new to R2? Because my 2008 Terminal Server Resource book points out that all servers need to have identical application installations. In any case the quote makes it look bad to silo applications. It is not. It is merely a method by which to segregate servers to which users are directed. I would not want my Great Plains users and EMR users to be on the same server running those concurrently, as both are enormous resources hogs. >>> David Lum <[email protected]> 10/29/2010 3:03 PM >>> “Great Plains users on a few servers, EMR on another, another bunch of servers for general apps. Not possible in Terminal Server” Huh? Are you talking about this scenario? “Your customer wants to install and then publish an application to 3 out of 5 new 2008 based Terminal Servers in their new farm and load balance that application across the 3 servers in question (but remember, they are not licensed for the application to publish it across the remaining 2 servers). Now this is a typical example of the kind of administration and application deployment that can happen every day in a Citrix environment, but there is a slight problem here. They would need to split the farm containing the 5 servers in two, because a farm in the Terminal Services 2008 sense is a group of servers that are configured identically with applications and the remaining 2 servers are not.“ I ask because in the strict sense you can put some apps on some TS servers but not others. I’m wondering at what scale it makes sense to choose XenApp vs. TS 2K8? We, for example have all of 15 licenses for Citrix (and have got by with just one server) and have been that way for over 3 years. I just kicked up to 50 CAL’s of W2K8 TS and am creating a simple TS farm of 3 servers, but your comments make me curious… Dave From: Tom Miller [mailto:[email protected]] Sent: Friday, October 29, 2010 8:15 AM To: NT System Admin Issues Subject: RE: Citrix or Windows Terminal Server? I did just that, Webster. I tried to save our organization some money by using Terminal Server 2008 for our enterprise medical system. That lasted maybe a year of constant issues. Meanwhile my XenApp systems hummed along quietly. Currently I am moving the Terminal Servers XenApp systems. One thing I really like about XenApp is siloing. Great Plains users on a few servers, EMR on another, another bunch of servers for general apps. Not possible in Terminal Server. So the money I saved was burned by man hours supporting it. >>> "Webster" <[email protected]> 10/29/2010 10:12 AM >>> “I’d love to hear why people would recommend Citrix over TS 2008” http://www.dabcc.com/article.aspx?id=9771 At my previous employer, we had several customers that tried moving from Presentation Server 4.5 to TS2008, gave up and moved back. IMNSHO, TS2008 just doesn’t scale well for large enterprises unless you have some very experienced people around. Webster From: David Lum [mailto:[email protected]] Subject: RE: Citrix or Windows Terminal Server? Last I checked TS licensing was far cheaper than Citrix – see if there’s a big price delta. If yes, then see if there’s any reason the cheaper solution wouldn’t work. If no big price difference do you have any in-house knowledge that knows one app better than the other? I am in the midst of standing up 2008 Terminal Servers to replace our aging Citrix Metaframe and 2008 R2 TS is very easy to set up. To add into this question, I’d love to hear why people would recommend Citrix over TS 2008. TS 2008’s application management is far better than previous Terminal Server versions. From: Sean Rector [mailto:[email protected]] Subject: RE: Citrix or Windows Terminal Server? It’ll be Server 2008 R2, 64-bit. From: Webster [mailto:[email protected]] Subject: RE: Citrix or Windows Terminal Server? Windows??? Do you mean 2003, 2008 or R2? If 2003 or 2008, 32-bit or 64-bit? Webster From: Sean Rector [mailto:[email protected]] Subject: RE: Citrix or Windows Terminal Server? Windows – the application is Tessitura (http://www.tessitura-network.org), and is used for CRM & Ticketing for arts organizations. From: Webster [mailto:[email protected]] Subject: RE: Citrix or Windows Terminal Server? What OS will you be hosting the application on? From: Sean Rector [mailto:[email protected]] Subject: Citrix or Windows Terminal Server? Hello, We’re looking at hosting an application for several other arts organizations. My thinking is that we should use one of these two technologies – but I’m not sure which one. We’re behind an ISA 2006 firewall, and we’re looking at increasing our internet pipe to Cavalier’s Ethernet over Copper product (from a T-1) at 5M. 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