On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 10:34 PM, Benjamin Root <[email protected]> wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 15, 2010 at 8:28 AM, Ralf Gommers <[email protected] > > wrote: > >> >> >> On Fri, Sep 10, 2010 at 12:05 AM, Peter < >> [email protected]> wrote: >> >>> Hi all, >>> >>> NumPy currently makes extensive use of the DeprecationWarning >>> class to alert users when some feature is going to be withdrawn. >>> However, as of Python 2.7, the DeprecationWarning is silent by >>> default, see: >>> >>> >>> http://docs.python.org/library/warnings.html#updating-code-for-new-versions-of-python >>> >>> This makes sense to me for deprecation warnings from Python >>> itself or the standard library - after all, Python 2.7 is the last of the >>> Python 2.x series. >>> >> >> The reason for the change is explained in the paragraph you link to, 2.7 >> being the final minor release in the 2.x series isn't it. >> >> There are many other packages/programs built on numpy, the user/developer >> distinction can be made in the same way as for Python itself. I fail to see >> a reason not to follow the lead of the Python core developers here. >> >> Cheers, >> Ralf >> >> >> > I have to agree a bit with Peter. I do understand the rationale of > Python's position, however, I have to wonder what is the point of > DeprecationWarning if it doesn't get displayed? The warning is supposed to > give a heads-up to the developer to modify their code. > > Now, the argument can be made that a python developer should know to run > python with those warnings unmuted. And I would agree for "true", career > programmers. However, numpy/scipy/matplotlib have become environments unto > themselves, catered to converts from Matlab, R, S+ and other such > languages. I would argue that many of the "developers" are not typical > programmers with proper development habits/skills. Many (myself included) > are graduate students in scientific fields unrelated to computer science. I > have to wonder how many of them would even be aware of the differences > between python versions (or even which version they are using!). > > Anyway, my point is that the deprecation warnings are very valuable to > display and that we need to keep in mind the audience that SciPy has. Maybe > we don't necessarily turn them on by default (somehow), but maybe the > documentation should highly recommend that they get turned on, thereby > raising awareness on the part of the user. > Sure, documenting this well and recommending to turn on the warnings for example once after installation and once before upgrading makes a lot of sense. Places to document it: http://www.scipy.org/FAQ http://projects.scipy.org/numpy/wiki/TestingGuidelines Any others? Ralf > There is a side-benefit to mentioning the muted warnings issue in the > documentation. If a developer later complains that a feature was removed > without any deprecation notices, we could simply point to the documentation > and say that we recommended turning the warnings on. > > My 2 cents, > Ben Root > > > _______________________________________________ > NumPy-Discussion mailing list > [email protected] > http://mail.scipy.org/mailman/listinfo/numpy-discussion > >
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