Hi - > On Sep 21, 2018, at 9:21 AM, Svante Schubert <svante.schub...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > Tom, > > Do have a pointer to Labs? > I only found a company: > https://apache-labs.com/al-pages/1007/Company-Profile.html > Just curious to know all potential choices.
Apache Labs is at labs.apache.org > > BTW I will be attending the LibreOffice conference in Albania next week and > aim to discuss the potential future of ODF Toolkit at the TDF with some of > the members. > This will be just in time for our next incubator report. I’m definitely OK with that. Regards, Dave > > All the best, > Svante > ᐧ > > Am Di., 11. Sep. 2018 um 16:24 Uhr schrieb Tom Barber <t...@spicule.co.uk>: > >> Whilst I tend to agree with Dave, it would be a shame to kick the ODF >> Toolkit out without some thinking. One thought I did have was would it be >> possible to migrate ODF Toolkit from Incubator to Labs to keep the >> development going but also lessen the burden on the incubator? >> >> >> On 11 September 2018 at 10:50:04, Svante Schubert ( >> svante.schub...@gmail.com) wrote: >> >> Hello Dave, Everyone! >> >> A natural place to move this project is TDF (The Document Foundation) >> <https://www.documentfoundation.org/>. >> Both LibreOffice and OpenOffice are of course heavy users of the ODF file >> format and in need of tools and validators. >> There should be no problem to move to TDF and let them take over the >> domain. >> >> A more interesting question IMO would be, what progress does this project >> have to make and what costs do we generate to Apache and/or can we lower >> them? >> >> Allow me to draft some viable future for our project: >> What we can be certain is, that there does not exist any interoperable >> office document collaboration in the world so far and people are longing >> for it. >> Office 365 & Google Docs are closed source and breaking often the >> structure of business office documents, e.g. EU funding application >> templates. >> >> Therefore, I have created a prototype for the Toolkit enabled for >> Collaboration >> <https://github.com/svanteschubert/odftoolkit/tree/odf-changes>, which >> was sponsored by PrototypeFund >> <https://prototypefund.de/project/documents-for-democracy/> / German >> Ministry of Research >> <https://www.bmbf.de/de/software-sprint-freie-programmierer-unterstuetzen-3512.html> >> last winter. >> Why is this important? Because sending office documents by email / Dropbox >> / etc. for collaboration is as clever as if software developer would zip >> their source code repositories and sending these via email / Dropbox / etc. >> The major question you ask your coworkers to be able to merge their >> changes back is: What have you changed? >> For this reason, this prototype module is switching the paradigm from the >> document file format (full state) to an equivalent list of user changes >> (creating in sum the same full state). >> This Toolkit prototype on collaboration >> <https://github.com/svanteschubert/odftoolkit/tree/odf-changes> >> transforms any OpenDocument Text into an equivalent sequence of user >> changes (in JSON - see attachments) and in addition, is able to apply any >> new user change (similar in JSON) to the document by merging the change >> into it. By doing so, the module is taking away the complexity of knowledge >> about the ODF documents and is a perfect fit as a back-end when office >> documents entering the realm of a business domain. >> >> Why am I telling you this? >> As I am confident that we need more than a group of individuals that work >> on this project in their spare time. We need companies, which consider this >> toolkit as a backbone of their business case. >> To make it more obvious to managers (and to the Apache board members) to >> believe in the importance of this project, I am working on a showcase where >> we attach an existing open-source web editor as front-end, where we could >> view and edit ODT documents. >> >> For this reason, I have been travelling recently to Warschau and visited >> CKSource <https://cksource.com/> to investigate if the "Toolkit >> Collaboration prototype >> <https://github.com/svanteschubert/odftoolkit/tree/odf-changes>" could be >> attached to their new flagship CKEdit5 <https://ckeditor.com/ckeditor-5/> >> based on operations & changes >> <https://github.com/ckeditor/ckeditor5-engine/tree/master/src/model/operation> >> . >> You know, in extreme even a Microsoft Office (MSO) user could collaborate >> with a user using VI text editor by exchanging user changes. While the MSO >> user would see and edit the full-featured document, the VI user would only >> see and edit text and paragraphs (the latter emulated as lines). Still, all >> VI text & paragraph edits could be merged back into the original document >> using Operational Transformation (OT) >> <http://www.codecommit.com/blog/java/understanding-and-applying-operational-transformation>. >> If this works for VI, it will work for CKEdit5 for sure and using a >> web-based editor embeddable into any web page is far more attractive to the >> masses than VI - please, no discussions on this assumption ;-) >> >> End of the month, on the 26th of September I will be in Tirana (Albania) >> and give a talk about Interoperable Document Collaboration >> <https://libocon.org/2018/the-program/sept-26th-wednesday/> and >> hopefully, I have the front-end running by then. >> I will keep you informed... >> >> In the end, we would like to provide a setup-up using an open office >> application that allows receiving "pull requests" consisting of changes >> only from other users. >> For instance useable when a famous author publishes his book read-only and >> some readers provide feedback by those "pull requests", allowing the author >> to merge only the changes, neglecting the risk to loose or receiving >> compromised information by overtaking the full document. >> A wonderful obvious business case for lawyers... >> >> As you see, there's a ton of good stuff coming or in the queue, with a lot >> of potential for good press & new developers. >> From where I stand, it would be a terrible moment to shut down. >> >> Sincerely, >> Svante >> ᐧ >> >> Am Mo., 10. Sep. 2018 um 21:42 Uhr schrieb Dave Fisher < >> dave2w...@comcast.net>: >> >>> Hi - >>> >>> It seems that the number of developers actively working on the ODF >>> Toolkit has never grown large enough to be sustainable as an Apache Top >>> Level Project. After nearly 7 years in the Incubator it is time for the ODF >>> Toolkit community to move on. >>> >>> I think retirement would consist of the following steps. >>> >>> (1) Decide if the project will move elsewhere - perhaps to its own GitHub >>> repository. >>> (2) Decide what entity or person should take over odftoolkit.org domain >>> name. >>> >>> Once those are decided then we can do a VOTE. >>> >>> Regards, >>> Dave >>> >> >> Spicule Limited is registered in England & Wales. Company Number: >> 09954122. Registered office: First Floor, Telecom House, 125-135 Preston >> Road, Brighton, England, BN1 6AF. 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