Yeah, yeah, I know.  :-)

I just want somebody to say, "you're late to the game, but the rest of us 
decided a long time ago to stick together and do the opposite of what the JFIF 
standard says, trust us you won't break anything."



> On May 19, 2016, at 2:48 PM, Jonathan Egstad <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> The industry did not evolve in a scientifically rigorous way.  ;)
> 
> 
> On May 19, 2016, at 2:43 PM, Larry Gritz <[email protected]> wrote:
> 
> Yeah, I'm fine with whatever they want to call it internally.
> 
> OpenEXR/ImfStandardAttributes.h agrees with me:
> 
> //
> // xDensity -- horizontal output density, in pixels per inch.
> // The image's vertical output density is xDensity * pixelAspectRatio.
> //
> 
> When I make an exr file with ydensity=xdensity*pixelaspectratio, and a par=2, 
> I get a wide image in Nuke.
> 
> When I make a JPEG with ydensity=xdensity*pixelaspectratio and par=2, I get a 
> skinny image in Nuke.
> 
> Nuke's JPEG reader/writer is interpreting the xdensity and ydensity fields as 
> sizes, not densities.
> 
> But then again, so are PhotoShop, ffmpeg, and rv. OIIO is the only package 
> that seems to take the JFIF spec on face value. I don't see how we have much 
> choice other than to also be wrong, we certainly can't make files that will 
> come out wrong in many VFX apps.
> 
> 
>> On May 19, 2016, at 2:21 PM, Jonathan Egstad <[email protected]> wrote:
>> 
>> If it makes you feel any better, the Nuke notation is based on film 
>> terminology where the anamorphic value refers to the projector lens stretch, 
>> not the camera lens squeeze.  i.e. 2.0 means x2 in display width.
>> 
>> Typically anamorphic is not referred to as 0.5...
>> 
>> -j
>> 
>> On May 19, 2016, at 1:34 PM, Larry Gritz <[email protected]> wrote:
>> 
>> No, but it doesn't agree after all!
>> 
>> When I instruct oiiotool to write an OpenEXR with pixel aspect of 2.0, Nuke 
>> correctly displays it as wide.
>> 
>> Same with TIFF.
>> 
>> But when oiiotool writes a JPEG with pixel aspect of 2.0 -- I *THINK* I'm 
>> doing it right, there is no JPEG aspect field, in infers it from the x and y 
>> densities (pixels per inch), so I set ydensity = aspect*xdensity -- then 
>> Nuke displays it as as skinny rather than wide.
>> 
>> Apparently, PhotoShop, rv, and ffmpeg all agree with Nuke.
>> 
>> So it must be me who is wrong here! But for the life of me, I can't figure 
>> out from the JFIF spec why the Nuke/rv/ffmpeg/PS interpretation makes sense.
>> 
>> Either the problem is entirely in my head -- I'm just interpreting the JFIF 
>> spec incorrectly -- or else a long time ago somebody got it backwards, and 
>> now everybody else is just trying to be compatible despite not agreeing with 
>> the spec.
>> 
>> 
>>> On May 19, 2016, at 1:17 PM, Jonathan Egstad <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> 
>>> (typing on a small iphone atm so I'll check out the thread in more detail 
>>> later)
>>> 
>>> You're correct about what Nuke's format.pixel_aspect() is - it's the 
>>> correction factor from pixel-storage to real-world coordinates.
>>> So a Nuke format with pa 2.0 is typically an anamorphic image where the 
>>> stored pixels are half their real-world width and require stretching out 
>>> horizontally when viewed.
>>> 
>>> As for the jpeg reader/writer I wrote a pa 2.0 checkerboard jpeg out of 
>>> Nuke and it displays correctly in ffmpeg's ffplay viewer - i.e. not 
>>> squished.
>>> For reference DWA's internal viewing tool ignores the density vars and 
>>> displays a squished image.
>>> 
>>> So I think you're interpretation is correct in OIIO, and Nuke, RV & ffmpeg 
>>> agree with it.
>>> 
>>> -j
>>> 
>>> On May 19, 2016, at 10:43 AM, Larry Gritz <[email protected]> wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi, Jonathan, thanks!
>>> 
>>> If you could quickly read over the discussion in this PR: 
>>> https://github.com/OpenImageIO/oiio/pull/1412
>>> 
>>> (It's not overly long or technical, but it might make you scratch your head 
>>> a bit.)
>>> 
>>> The question is: Do you know anything about what Nuke is up to in the cited 
>>> JPEG code? Do you believe Nuke is computing the aspect ratio for JPEG files 
>>> backwards (versus the JFIF spec), or do you think that my interpretation of 
>>> JFIF's fields are incorrect?
>>> 
>>> If Nuke is wrong, does that mean that we'd better do it wrong, too, or be 
>>> forever doomed to have the aspect ratio being mangled when Nuke reads our 
>>> files or vice versa? Or is there another solution you can think of that 
>>> doesn't involve our having to introduce a bug? (I don't imagine that the 
>>> Foundry will deem it practical to suddenly change Nuke's interpretation at 
>>> this stage, even if it's technically wrong.)
>>> 
>>> 
>>>> On May 19, 2016, at 10:02 AM, Jonathan Egstad <[email protected]> 
>>>> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Hey Larry,
>>>> I'm one of the original Nuke authors but not with the Foundry - if you 
>>>> need help with general plugin coding questions maybe I can help.
>>>> 
>>>> Cheers,
>>>> -j
>>>> 
>>>> On May 18, 2016, at 10:18 AM, Larry Gritz <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> Anybody from the Foundry who works on Nuke reading this?
>>> 
>>> --
>>> Larry Gritz
>>> [email protected]
>>> 
>>> 
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>> 
>> --
>> Larry Gritz
>> [email protected]
>> 
>> 
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> 
> --
> Larry Gritz
> [email protected]
> 
> 
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--
Larry Gritz
[email protected]


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