I remember having this discussion not too long ago. I thought it was here,
but maybe it was with list memebr Mark Mullins and another forum.
Mark??????????
Anyway, there are a few problems with the use of ethanol or methanol in
standard automotive fuel systems, even if its a 15% gasoline/85% ethanol
mix.
1) For modern cars, only cars rated as bi-fuel from the factory can
sucessfully use E85. The computer system, with one or a few code changes,
will adequately alter the air/fuel ratio for use with E85. The seals in the
fuels systems of these bi-fuel cars are also capable of being used with
alcohols. I don't know how the steel corrosion problem is dealt with.
2) One MUST remember the molecular structure of an alcohol. Oxygen and OH
radicals are bound up in the molecule. That's why in some areas, 10-15%
ethanol is already used in the gasoline sold there, under EPA mandate, to
oxygenate the fuel for emmissions reduction. That fuel already drops fuel
economy by about 3-5% and makes the engine run leaner, but not to a
dangerous level.
3) Older cars need the jets enlarged to increase fuel flow with E85 to get
the correct air/fuel ratio and not burn up the engine from a way too lean
condition. There are some reports of some older cars getting away with it.
Those owners were lucky.
4) Rubber seals used in gasoline fuel systems are not compatible with any
alcohols. They will die.
5) Alcohol stored in a bare steel can, the inside uncoated by any protective
layer, will cause the steel to rust. Why? Because of the OH radicals and O2
available in the molecule. That's why the fuel additive called HEET, used to
remove water from gasoline, works. It's pure alcohol which mixes with the
water in the gas, absorbes it, and allows the water to be actually burned,
due to the alcohol content. With no water in the gas, the OH radicals and
the O2 will attack the unprotected steel gas tank and steel fuel lines on
the inside. To successfully use E85, or pure methanol in a race car, the
fuel tank needs to be coated with epoxy on the inside or be replaced with a
plastic fuel tank or a safety fuel tank with a fuel bladder and the fuel
lines need to be stainless steel, which will not be affected by alcohol.
6) Aluminum fuel tanks and carbs will also be corroded by continuous use of
alcohols. Aluminum oxide will form wherever the alcohol is present, unless
the aluminum is coated with a protective barrier impervious to the alcohol.
I regrete there is no free lunch with E85. We can't get something for
nothing.
Milton Schick
1964 442 Cutlass
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Back in the late 90's the University of Tennessee concluded a research
project that they had been doing for several years in regards to E85 as a
fuel.
At that time they put up for sale/auction a half dozen plus cars, (87
Turbo T
Regal's) that they had used for the project. I don't remember the
details
completely, but there were several modifications that had to be made to
the
cars including larger stainless steel gas tanks, larger injectors, ECM
chip
reprogramming and I don't recall whatever else. All the cars sold pretty
cheap
compared to the values of regular Turbo Regal's at the time, because the
fuel
was not available and I think there were some extensive costs involved in
converting them back to gas. I don't if there's a way to tap into the
data at
UT and find out all the skinny on what they did with this.
