[Winona Online Democracy]
Hello Paul (Double),
More of my opinions and responses to your responses.
1. Low Turnout: Isn't that why we need to allow 3rd parties to exist?
That way more parites can reach out can connect with a wider set of issues
in more personal and direct ways. Our current system of rules stacks the
deck against 3rd parties. We have a two party monopoly. More controlled
competiton can bring in more ideas. Don't you agree?
2. Other Countries By Comparison: Look at almost any of the Scandanvian
or Western European countries. I wish our media would do more of this. We
would learn a lot if we were humble and wise enough to compare our system
to other countries.
3. Correlation Between Wealth and Power: It seems like you ducked the
original question, the one asking, "is there a connection between wealth
and voting?". Don't you find it funny that the govt. that is controlled by
the wealthy and powerful has created a system that benefits the wealthy and
powerful? Isn't it funny that money controls our elections now and that
the issues that directly affect people with less wealth and power are not
being addressed? Isn't there a direct correlation between wealth and
voting percentages? Do you think that our govt. is representative of the
people they represent? Women, minorities, middle and lower class people?
Tell me more about the use of Monday Night Football fans in your
explanation about why people do not vote.
You have many good points, keep them coming.
Dwayne
===============
>Date: Sat, 11 Nov 2000 11:30:12 -0600 (CST)
>X-Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>From: Paul Double <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Subject: [Winona] Democratic Involvement
>Mime-Version: 1.0
>Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>Precedence: bulk
>
>[Winona Online Democracy]
>
>My opinion and attempts to your questions are:
>
>1. When two candidates for the same office have very similar positions on
>many issues some people do not have a burning desire to vote. If on the
>other hand their positions are radically different I would anticipate a
>higher percent will vote some out of fear and some to support. In
>addition, I believe that some also feel they have no power and therefore
>why invest the time if nothing will change.
>
>2. I would like to know what the countries are since I would think they
>would reflect two or three major consistencies. a) In countries where
>people have been denied the right to vote and then it becomes available I
>would expect higher turnouts. b) In countries which may have fought major
>wars during which their right to vote was denied or suppressed I would
>expect higher turnouts. c) When people feel they are empowered by their
>vote I would expect larger turnouts. Initiative and referendum options
>would in my opinion solve part of that problem.
>
>3) I disagree with the implications of the third question - "People vote
>regardless of their wealth if they feel empowered by their vote". If you
>are going to take away ones right to chose what to do with the money that
>they have worked hard to earn then they may have a greater incentive to
>vote. "People invest their time and talent in whatever is their passion."
>If their passion is Monday night football why would they attend a Monday
>School Board Meeting. If their passion is their kids or educational
>improvement then maybe the place they will show up is at the School Board
>Meeting. People, regardless of wealth put their energy into what they feel
>is important. One of the responsibilies of those elected is to excite
>people into becoming involved thus making things better at whatever
>activity we are engaged in.
>
>If I disagree with the direction of the country, second right amendments or
>whatever the issue I will expend whatever energy is necessary to engage,
>perswade and convince others so as to attempt to prevail in the outcome.
>My sons have been raised to understand and believe that commitment to cause
>makes most things possible.
>
>Paul Double
>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>>Date: Fri, 10 Nov 2000 15:47:37 -0500
>>Hello Paul,
>>
>>You raised some good points and I won't argue that there will always be a
>>few people who prefer to exercise their right not to vote and be heard.
>>
>>At the same time, beyond individual laziness, do you think there are any
>>systemic reasons for low voter turnout?
>>
>>Why do other countries have much higher voter turnouts than the U.S.? Are
>>Americans just lazy?
>>
>>Isn't there a connection between wealth and voting or are poor people just
>>plain lazy?
>>
>>Dwayne
>>
>>============
>>
>>
>>>[Winona Online Democracy]
>>>
>>>Public Policy is determined by those who show up. That includes the
>>>elections, City Council, County and School Board meetings and active
>>>participation in Planning Commissions, Focus Groups etc. Those who want to
>>>enjoy the fruits of Democracy also need to make an investment of their time
>>>and talent. With involvement policies, rules and laws can change but
>>>those who side on the sidelines may not like the outcome. So get involved,
>>>strive to make things better or sit back and pay the bills and complain,
>>>complain, complain.
>>>
>>>Paul Double
>>>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>
>>>
>>>don >Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 13:58:20 -0500
>>>>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>>From: Dwayne Voegeli <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>>>Subject: [Winona] Election Turnout Misperception?
>>>>Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>>
>>>>[Winona Online Democracy]
>>>>
>>>>Hello Paul and Others,
>>>>
>>>>In regards to heavy voter turnout, correct me if I'm wrong with this
>>>statement:
>>>>
>>>>The Winona Daily News stated in an article today that the voter turnout was
>>>>as high as 85% in some precincts.
>>>>
>>>>The article was only talking about people who had already preregistered.
>>>>
>>>>Doesn't that mean that the number does NOT reflect all the people who have
>>>>not registered to vote?
>>>>
>>>>Am I accurate?
>>>>
>>>>If so, even though the number is nice, it does not represent the numbers of
>>>>all potential voters.
>>>>
>>>>What do you think?
>>>>
>>>>Dwayne
>>>>
>>>>==============
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2000 09:33:35 -0600 (CST)
>>>>>X-Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>>>To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>>>From: Paul Double <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>>>>Subject: [Winona] Elections
>>>>>Mime-Version: 1.0
>>>>>Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>>>Precedence: bulk
>>>>>
>>>>>I second your comment. It was a long but good day. Lots of people
>>>>>registering to vote either as new voters or because of relocation. I
>>>>>believe many precincts were close to 85 percent turnout.
>>>>>The new Secretary of State web site is also a big plus in getting the
>>>>>details and breakdowns. http://elections.sos.state.mn.us
>>>>>
>>>>>Paul Double
>>>>>[EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>>>
>>>>>>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>>>>Date: Wed, 8 Nov 2000 15:15:49 EST
>>>>>>Subject: [Winona] Elections
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> I really enjoy being able to be an election judge, working to
>continue
>>>>>>our great process that we have. It's amazing how everyone is able to
>set
>>>>>>their political adgendas aside and work for more than 15 hrs together
>with
>>>>>>the common goal of helping every eligible voter exercise their right to
>>>vote
>>>>>>within the rules provided.
>>>>>> The head judges are really very important members of our community,
>>>>>>doing their best to maintain these rules. We have a great process!
>>>It's
>>>>>>a lot to be proud of!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Kathleen Giebel
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Attachment converted: Macintosh HD:WinonaEl (TEXT/ttxt) (0001F10E)
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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>>>>
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>>
>>
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**********************************************************
Dwayne and Denine Voegeli
Social Studies and Science Teachers
Winona Senior High School
901 W. Gilmore Ave.
Winona, MN 55987 USA
Home Voice Mail: (507) 453-9012
School telephone number: (507) 454-9509
E-mail address: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Personal Web Page: http://www.jarviscomputer.com/voegeli
High School Web Site: http://wshs.luminet.net/
A Web Site About the City of Winona: http://winonanet.com/home.html
"Education is not preparation for life, education is life itself."
-- John Dewey
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