But there are even other places which can and should be improved. I
did some tests with some viewers counting the web
requests to the central infrastructure:
Test 1: Teleport from a Plaza to one of my regions located on a
server in Europe and afterwards logging out:
Cool VL Viewer: 912 Requests mostly SynchronousRestForms POST
http://presence.osgrid.org/presence ( i guess to inform
all my 809 friends [mostly only 5% online] I am going offline because
the calls to the presence service were done after
i closed the viewer)
Singularity Veiwer: 921 Requests mostly calls to presence after logoff
Teapot viewer: 910 Requests mostly calls to presence after logoff
Astra Viewer: 917 Requests mostly calls to presence after logoff
Firestorm: 1005 Requests mostly calls to presence after logoff
Imprudence: 918 mostly calls to presence after logoff
So far so good. I have no idea why my 760 offline friends have to be
informed that I went offline ...
(Details can be found here:
https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B301xueh1kxdNG1wLWo2YVVfYjA )
Test 2: Direct Login onto my Region and then Logoff-( with
FetchInventory2 disabled )
Cool VL Viewer: 2232 Requests mostly calls to presence ~800 during
login and ~800 during logout and xinventory
Singularity Viwer: 2340 Requests mostly calls to presence and xinventory
Teapot Viewer: Produced 500+ Threads in a very short time and then
the OpenSim.exe crashed
Astra Viewer: 2831 Request mostly calls to presence and xinventory
Firestorm Viwer: ACK Timeout for me. OpenSim.exe survived on 500
Threads for 30+ minutes producing 4996 Requests mostly
xinventory
Imprudence: 1745 Requests mostly presence
Again why do all my 809 friends have do be verified with single
requests? Then why this difference in xinventory
Requests? And why are both Teapot and Firestorm producing so many
Threads in such a short time? and bring OpenSim.exe to
crash or closely to crash ...
( Details can be found here:
https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B301xueh1kxdMDJxWm5UR2QtU2c )
( Details can be found here:
https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B301xueh1kxdNEtEeUVFamU1QUE )
Just my observations this week end.
Akira
2012/10/13 Justin Clark-Casey <[email protected]
<mailto:[email protected]>>
Hi Michelle. I've now had some more time to think about this.
In fact, I established a proposal summary page at
[1] which I'll change as we go along (or please feel free to
change yourself). We do need to fix this problem of
group IM taking massive time with groups that aren't that big.
I do like the approach of caching online status (and login time)
in the groups service.
1. It's reasonably simple.
2. One network call to fetch online group members per IM.
3. May allow messaging across multiple OpenSimulator installations.
However, this approach does mean
1. Independently updating the groups services on each
login/logout. I'm not saying this is a problem, particularly
if it saves traffic later on.
2. Groups service has to deal with extra information. Again,
this is fairly simple so not necessarily a fatal
issue though it does mean every groups implementations needs to
do this in some manner.
3. Online cache is not reusable by other services in the future.
On a technical note, the XmlRpc groups module does in theory
cache data for 30 seconds by default, so a change in
online status may not be seen for upto 30 seconds. I personally
think that this is a reasonable tradeoff.
Rather, of the above cons, 3 is the one I'm finding most
serious. If other services would also benefit from online
status caching in the future, they would have to implement their
own caches (and be updated from simulators).
I do agree that making a GridUser.LoggedIn() call for every
single group member on every single IM is unworkable.
Even if this is only done once and cached for a certain period
of time it could be a major issue for large groups.
So an alternative approach could be to add a new call to GridUser
service (maybe LoggedIn(List<UUID>) that will only
return GridInfo for those that are logged in. This could then be
cached simulator-side for a certain period of time
(e.g. 30 seconds like the groups information) and used for group IM.
This has the advantages that
1. Groups and future services don't need to do their own login
caching.
2. Future services can use the same information and code rather
than have to cache login information themselves.
However, it does
1. Require GridUserInfo caching simulator-side, I would judge
this to be a more complex approach.
2. Mean that during the cache period, new online group messages
will not receive messages. (this is going to
happen with GetGroupMembers() caching anyway).
3. Traffic is still generated to the GridUser service at the end
of every simulator-side caching period. This is
probably not a huge burden.
So right now, I'm somewhat more in favour of a GridUserInfo
simulator-side caching approach than caching login
information within the groups service. However, unlike you, I
haven't actually tried to implement this approach so
there may well be issues that I haven't seen.
What do you think, Michelle (or anybody else)?
On 10/10/12 19:47, Michelle Argus wrote:
http://code.google.com/p/__flotsam/
<http://code.google.com/p/flotsam/> is the the current flotsam
version and
points to the github repro which I forked and
then patched.
None of the changes I proposed in my git fork have been
implemented, neither in opensim nor in flotsam.
Consider my proposal as a quick fix for the time beeing
which does not solve all other issues mentioned by later
mailings.
Am 09.10.2012 10:24, schrieb Ai Austin:
Michelle Argus on Wed Oct 3 18:00:23 CEST 2012:
I have added some changes to the group module of
OpenSim and the flotsam server.
...
The changes can be found in the 2 gits here:
<https://github.com/MAReantals__>https://github.com/MAReantals
NB: Both changes to flotsam and opensim are backward
compatible and do
not require that both parts are updated. If some
simulators are not
updated it can happen that some groupmembers do not
receive
groupmessages as their online status is not updated
correctly. In a grid
like OSgrid my recomendation would thus be to first
update the
simulators and at a later stage flotsam.
Hi Michelle... I am looking at what is needed to update
the Openvue grid which is using the flotsam XmlRpcGroups
module. the GITHub repository has the changes from a few
days ago... but I wonder if there has been an
update/commit
into the main Opensim Github area already. I cannot see
a related commit looking back over the last week
or so. Is
the core system updated so this module is up to date in
that? I also note that the Opensim.ini.example file
contains
a reference to http://code.google.com/p/__flotsam/
<http://code.google.com/p/flotsam/> for details of how to
install the service.. but that seems to be
pointing at an out of date version?
I think for the flotsam php end it is straightforward and
I obtained the changed groups.sql and xmlrpc.php files
needed. But note that people are still pointed via the
opensim.ini.example comments at the old version on
http://code.google.com/p/__flotsam/
<http://code.google.com/p/flotsam/> so that either needs updating to teh
latest version, or the comment in
opensim.ini.exmaple needs to be changed.
To avoid mistakes, I wonder if you can clarify where to
go for the parts needed and at what revision/date of
OpenSim
0.7.5 dev master this was introduced, what to get and
what to change for an existing service in terms of the
data base
tables, OpenSim.exe instance and the web support php code
areas?
Thanks Michelle, Ai
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Justin Clark-Casey (justincc)
OSVW Consulting
http://justincc.org
http://twitter.com/justincc
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