On Wed, Nov 28, 2018 at 12:31 PM Bogdan Dobrelya <bdobr...@redhat.com> wrote:
> Long story short, we cannot shoot both rabbits with a single shot, not
> with puppet :) May be we could with ansible replacing puppet fully...
> So splitting config and runtime images is the only choice yet to address
> the raised security concerns. And let's forget about edge cases for now.
> Tossing around a pair of extra bytes over 40,000 WAN-distributed
> computes ain't gonna be our the biggest problem for sure.

I think it's this last point that is the crux of this discussion. We
can agree to disagree about the merits of this proposal and whether
it's a pre-optimzation or micro-optimization, which I admit are
somewhat subjective terms. Ultimately, it seems to be about the "why"
do we need to do this as to the reason why the conversation seems to
be going in circles a bit.

I'm all for reducing container image size, but the reality is that
this proposal doesn't necessarily help us with the Edge use cases we
are talking about trying to solve.

Why would we even run the exact same puppet binary + manifest
individually 40,000 times so that we can produce the exact same set of
configuration files that differ only by things such as IP address,
hostnames, and passwords? Maybe we should instead be thinking about
how we can do that *1* time centrally, and produce a configuration
that can be reused across 40,000 nodes with little effort. The
opportunity for a significant impact in terms of how we can scale
TripleO is much larger if we consider approaching these problems with
a wider net of what we could do. There's opportunity for a lot of
better reuse in TripleO, configuration is just one area. The plan and
Heat stack (within the ResourceGroup) are some other areas.

At the same time, if some folks want to work on smaller optimizations
(such as container image size), with an approach that can be agreed
upon, then they should do so. We just ought to be careful about how we
justify those changes so that we can carefully weigh the effort vs the
payoff. In this specific case, I don't personally see this proposal
helping us with Edge use cases in a meaningful way given the scope of
the changes. That's not to say there aren't other use cases that could
justify it though (such as the security points brought up earlier).

-- James Slagle

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