Yes, maybe. I'm interested in a pluggable IPAM module that will allocate an IP
address for a VM that depends on where that VM's host is in the physical data
center network. Is that similar to your requirement?
I don't yet know whether that might lead me to want to store additional data in
the Neutron DB. My intuition though is that it shouldn't, and that any
additional data or state that I need for this IPAM module should be stored
separately from the Neutron DB.
Regards,
Neil
From: Shraddha Pandhe
Sent: Friday, 6 November 2015 20:23
To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions)
Reply To: OpenStack Development Mailing List (not for usage questions)
Subject: Re: [openstack-dev] [Neutron][IPAM] Arbitrary JSON blobs in ipam db
tables
Bumping this up :)
Folks, does anyone else have a similar requirement to ours? Are folks making
scheduling decisions based on networking?
On Thu, Nov 5, 2015 at 12:24 PM, Shraddha Pandhe
<spandhe.openst...@gmail.com<mailto:spandhe.openst...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Hi,
I agree with all of you about the REST Apis.
As I said before, I had to bring up the idea of JSON blob because based on
previous discussions, it looked like neutron community was not willing to
enhance the schemas for different ipam dbs. Entire rationale behind pluggable
IPAM is to provide flexibility. So, community should be open to ideas for
enhancing the schema to incorporate more information in the db tables. I would
be extremely happy if use cases for different companies are considered and
schema is enhanced to include specific columns in db schemas instead of a
column with random JSON blob.
Lets pick up subnets db table for example. We have some use cases where it
would be great if following information is associated with the subnet db table
1. Rack switch info
2. Backplane info
3. DHCP ip helpers
4. Option to tag allocation pools inside subnets
5. Multiple gateway addresses
We also want to store some information about the backplanes locally, so a
different table might be useful.
In a way, this information is not specific to our company. Its generic
information which ought to go with the subnets. Different companies can use
this information differently in their IPAM drivers. But, the information needs
to be made available to justify the flexibility of ipam
In Yahoo! OpenStack is still not the source of truth for this kind of
information and database limitation is one of the reasons. I would prefer to
avoid having our own database to make sure that our use-cases are always shared
with the community.
On Thu, Nov 5, 2015 at 9:37 AM, Kyle Mestery
<mest...@mestery.com<mailto:mest...@mestery.com>> wrote:
On Thu, Nov 5, 2015 at 10:55 AM, Jay Pipes
<jaypi...@gmail.com<mailto:jaypi...@gmail.com>> wrote:
On 11/04/2015 04:21 PM, Shraddha Pandhe wrote:
Hi Salvatore,
Thanks for the feedback. I agree with you that arbitrary JSON blobs will
make IPAM much more powerful. Some other projects already do things like
this.
:( Actually, though "powerful" it also leads to implementation details leaking
directly out of the public REST API. I'm very negative on this and would prefer
an actual codified REST API that can be relied on regardless of backend driver
or implementation.
I agree with Jay here. We've had people propose similar things in Neutron
before, and I've been against them. The entire point of the Neutron REST API is
to not leak these details out. It dampens the strength of the logical model,
and it tends to have users become reliant on backend implementations.
e.g. In Ironic, node has driver_info, which is JSON. it also has an
'extras' arbitrary JSON field. This allows us to put any information in
there that we think is important for us.
Yeah, and this is a bad thing, IMHO. Public REST APIs should be structured, not
a Wild West free-for-all. The biggest problem with using free-form JSON blobs
in RESTful APIs like this is that you throw away the ability to evolve the API
in a structured, versioned way. Instead of evolving the API using
microversions, instead every vendor just jams whatever they feel like into the
JSON blob over time. There's no way for clients to know what the server will
return at any given time.
Achieving consensus on a REST API that meets the needs of a variety of backend
implementations is *hard work*, yes, but it's what we need to do if we are to
have APIs that are viewed in the industry as stable, discoverable, and reliably
useful.
++, this is the correct way forward.
Thanks,
Kyle
Best,
-jay
Best,
-jay
Hoping to get some positive feedback from API and DB lieutenants too.
On Wed, Nov 4, 2015 at 1:06 PM, Salvatore Orlando
<salv.orla...@gmail.com<mailto:salv.orla...@gmail.com>
<mailto:salv.orla...@gmail.com<mailto:salv.orla...@gmail.com>>> wrote:
Arbitrary blobs are a powerful tools to circumvent limitations of an
API, as well as other constraints which might be imposed for
versioning or portability purposes.
The parameters that should end up in such blob are typically
specific for the target IPAM driver (to an extent they might even
identify a specific driver to use), and therefore an API consumer
who knows what backend is performing IPAM can surely leverage it.
Therefore this would make a lot of sense, assuming API portability
and not leaking backend details are not a concern.
The Neutron team API & DB lieutenants will be able to provide more
input on this regard.
In this case other approaches such as a vendor specific extension
are not a solution - assuming your granularity level is the
allocation pool; indeed allocation pools are not first-class neutron
resources, and it is not therefore possible to have APIs which
associate vendor specific properties to allocation pools.
Salvatore
On 4 November 2015 at 21:46, Shraddha Pandhe
<spandhe.openst...@gmail.com<mailto:spandhe.openst...@gmail.com>
<mailto:spandhe.openst...@gmail.com<mailto:spandhe.openst...@gmail.com>>>
wrote:
Hi folks,
I have a small question/suggestion about IPAM.
With IPAM, we are allowing users to have their own IPAM drivers
so that they can manage IP allocation. The problem is, the new
ipam tables in the database have the same columns as the old
tables. So, as a user, if I want to have my own logic for ip
allocation, I can't actually get any help from the database.
Whereas, if we had an arbitrary json blob in the ipam tables, I
could put any useful information/tags there, that can help me
for allocation.
Does this make sense?
e.g. If I want to create multiple allocation pools in a subnet
and use them for different purposes, I would need some sort of
tag for each allocation pool for identification. Right now,
there is no scope for doing something like that.
Any thoughts? If there are any other way to solve the problem,
please let me know
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