On Saturday 12 November 2005 20:43, Pascal Bleser wrote: > Per Jessen wrote: > > Pascal Bleser wrote: > >> That may very well be constructive criticism, but what do you want ? > >> Give some ideas, directions, proposals. > > > > Given that Novell/SUSE are already struggling with this internally and > > have not really invited public participation in their discussion, I've > > held back. When they're prepared to discuss this in the open, I'll add > > my 2Rappen. > > So basically you're still not giving an example of how you imagine the > interaction between Novell and us. I still don't see where your problem is.
The idea is that we will have a system next year where all discussion can happen connected to the relevant parts. For instance you can subscribe to the X.org system and discuss and contribute there the future changes. > Just citing your mail in this thread: > "Decisions are made based on the commercial needs of Novell. At least > that's how I interpret the answers to earlier questions asked along the > same lines." > > I'd say that yes, it definately applies to certain decisions, such as what > is included and supported in the SUSE Linux distribution (i.e. product > management). My hope is that this will become less important, since it will be easy to install additional software easily later. And the pool of additional software is anyway way larger than anything what we could include into SUSE Linux directly (except we want to force everybody to download really large iso files) > And further on: > "I certainly second this motion, but I suspect it belongs to the overall > discussion of how open openSUSE is and/or is meant to be." > > Ok. So... what's your point here ? > What makes you say openSUSE isn't open ? > I wouldn't say openSUSE is open yet either, but why don't you give us some > precise points why you don't think it is ? We have simply to admit that we are not really open yet. There is no easy way for SUSE external people to submit additions or changes for now. But we really plan to deliver this next year. The idea is that it doesn't matter anymore, if you submit something with a @suse.de or any other account. On the other hand it is not possible for all of developers to be on this mailing list, because of the traffic and their daily work (they are quite busy on working on the SLES 10 stuff). The reason, why it is not possible for now is that our internal build system simply trusts everybody. This means that we can't grant access to it or we wouldn't be able to deliver any SLES (EAL certified) product anymore. This will be solved with a separated build system. The source from this build system will be taken later to produce the SLES based products in the internal one (After reviewing the code). > I'd be really interested to know, because I suppose you do have some valid > points about it, and discussing that on this very list would be interesting > and beneficial for everyone.. don't you think? > > But maybe I've found one thing that bothers you - citing you again, from a > past mail on this list > (http://lists.opensuse.org/archive/opensuse/2005-Sep/0517.html): > "So we've hit the crux of the problem - which seems pretty critical. > Although openSUSE is an "open" project, what goes and what doesn't is still > decided by the commercial needs requirements of Novell/SuSE. In many ways > also reasonably understandable, but it does beg the question - how open is > OpenSUSE really? [...] > Note - patches and proposals are only accepted provided they coincide with > SuSEs commercial plans and requirements." The decision power what will be in the Linux distribution on opensuse.org will go to the openSUSE community. If our product management disagrees to ship this we will have a fork. We should of course try to avoid this and I am in good hope that we can achieve this, because SUSE Linux should become the product from the community and for the current and future community. bye adrian -- Adrian Schroeter SUSE Linux Products GmbH, Maxfeldstr. 5, 90409 Nuernberg, Germany email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
