and your question is?
--- DENNIS WILLIAMS <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > All, > We are in transition here at my site. Our primary development tool > over the past few years has been a client-server tool named Uniface > from > Compuware, which does an excellent job of protecting developers from > themselves. However, we are switching to Java, and moving more > developers > from the mainframe to an Oracle-Java system that is being developed. > For a > Java IDE, it looks like a tool named TogetherSoft. I am concerned > that I > will need to take a more active role with the developers. > Dennis Williams > DBA > Lifetouch, Inc. > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > -----Original Message----- > Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 8:03 PM > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L > > > Greg, > > You *do* see DBA's doing the bulk of the SQL tuning work in many > shops. But > it's not necessarily because the developers, or at least some them, > can't, > or, that many of them don't care (and *many* of them never do give it > a > thought). I've seen places where the developers begged for the > ability to > turn on tracing in development, or to have a plan_table and/or the > use of > autotrace, and were denied. And other cases where the development, > testing, > and QA environments were so different from production that there was > nearly > no point. > > Anyway, just by virtue of their titles, I don't know that a DBA is > any > better at SQL tuning than a developer or vice versa (and I'm not > pointing > that comment at you, Greg, but just in general that I don't think the > title > of DBA or developer makes a difference). It really depends on their > backgrounds and skill levels. I've seen, for the most obvious > example, many > DBA's and developers freak when they see a full table scan, never > taking > into consideration if that was the appropriate approach. Instead, > they just > lived by some rule that "full table scans are bad". You see lots of > things > like that. > > Anyway, as someone who started off as both a DBA and developer, and > drifts > back and forth between the two and still serving in both roles, I can > see > both sides. I know DBA's who rant about the developers not giving a > flip > about performance when they write their code, and in many cases it is > true, > the issue of performance was never considered. But I also know many > developers who *do* care and are hindered from doing so. By the same > token, > I know a lot of DBA's who are very good at SQL tuning, and tuning and > general, and many more who aren't. > > So, what we can we do? We can work with the developers (and DBA's) > and > mentor them. We can teach the tricks and efficient styles (whether > SQL > itself or application design in general). And it really helps if we > can > provide an environment that mimics production (dollars and budgets > make that > hard to do in many cases). > > Sorry for the length, but it touches on something I'm dealing with > right > now. I'm helping some developers who are getting hammered about why > their > code performs so poorly in production. Heck, it ran great in all the > other > environments, there's not much more that they could have done. And > yes, I > now sit in on the code reviews making suggestions when something > could be > done better, and testing their code and every SQL statement against > production. Often times requires significant work in stubbing out the > DML > pieces and duplicating the same logic when doing so. But if they > aren't > given a "real" environment, and, they are interested, I have sympathy > when > seeing them hammered for poor performing code and SQL statements when > they > did everything they could with what they were provided. > > Oh well, end of the week rant of sorts. I'm sending everyone a case > of their > favorite scotch if they just ask ;-) Just a test to see if anyone > makes it > this far ;-) > > Regards, > > Larry G. Elkins > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > 214.954.1781 > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]On Behalf Of Greg > Moore > > Sent: Friday, March 29, 2002 4:38 PM > > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L > > Subject: Do programmers tune SQL? > > > > > > What percent of developers know how to explain and trace SQL, > interpret > > these reports and tune? > > > > In my experience it's about 10%, so most SQL tuning is done by > DBA's. Is > > that about right? > > -- > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com > -- > Author: Larry Elkins > INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Fat City Network Services -- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 > San Diego, California -- Public Internet access / Mailing > Lists > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may > also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). > -- > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com > -- > Author: DENNIS WILLIAMS > INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Fat City Network Services -- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 > San Diego, California -- Public Internet access / Mailing > Lists > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may > also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Yahoo! Greetings - send holiday greetings for Easter, Passover http://greetings.yahoo.com/ -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.com -- Author: Rachel Carmichael INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services -- (858) 538-5051 FAX: (858) 538-5051 San Diego, California -- Public Internet access / Mailing Lists -------------------------------------------------------------------- To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
