Dennis, > My understanding is that Oracle felt if it was going to be a 24x7x365 > database, it had to have more parameters that could be changed online
I couldn't agree more. 9i had more parameters that can be changed online; hope there are more in line. > it doesn't make sense to rely on the DBA > to remember to also update the init.ora file. You should be able to just > make the change once. Absolutely. That's the point I was trying to raise. Oracle did provide the spfile route to make _persistent_ changes on the fly, but for only those parameters that can be changed through alter system set ... The problem was there is a different file that needs to be updated when making those other parameter changes. There should be only one place to change - hopefully spfile - either through the alter system command or othe editing. This editing could be done through a GUI interface, too, if needed; although, call me old-fashioned (and I am old, anyway, at least in IT timeline), personally I prefer the vi editor. And this is not an impossible idea. I gave the example of the listener.ora file. It can be edited (so old fashioned), through the lsntctl SAVE_CONFIG command (so spfile-like) or through Net Assistant (so GUI-friendly). The end result is the same - one file - regardless of how you modify a parameter. The same approach could have been done in pfile-spfile case. > I think with the pfile and spfile, Oracle was trying to give us the best > of both worlds. Hmm! You think so? I think they just gave us a half-cooked hair-brained split-pea honey-mustard-ketchup-coated germ of a solution - sort of like Oracle 6 _without_ the Transaction Processing Option, if anyone remembers that. After you wipe off all those condiments, you find a Dr. Jekyll & Mr. Hyde parameter file(s)! Regards, Arup ----- Original Message ----- To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Wednesday, July 16, 2003 12:24 AM > Arup > My understanding is that Oracle felt if it was going to be a 24x7x365 > database, it had to have more parameters that could be changed online. Some > parameters were made changeable in Oracle9i, with hints of more to come. > If the future is online changes, it doesn't make sense to rely on the DBA > to remember to also update the init.ora file. You should be able to just > make the change once. > Also, there is a new generation of I.S. people coming along that doesn't > think you can operate a computer without a mouse. Against Microsoft's super > GUI interfaces, the idea of manually editing a text configuration file seems > very last century. > I think with the pfile and spfile, Oracle was trying to give us the best > of both worlds. How well they succeeded is a matter of judgement. > > Dennis Williams > DBA > Lifetouch, Inc. > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > -----Original Message----- > Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2003 9:14 PM > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L > > > The ability to change the system parameters without bouncing the system is > not provided by spfile, neither in RAC nor single instance databas. It > depends upon the the parameter that can be changed dynamically or not. > > I guess you wanted to convey the impression that the using spfiles the > parameters can be changed and the changes can be persistent across > shutdowns. But that is not just in RAC; it's true for single instance DBs, > too. > > Now, suppose you want to set a parameter that can't be changed using ALTER > SYSTEM, such as, say, java_pool_size. How do you plan to make the change? > You have to open up the old favorite init.ora file and start the database > with pfile=init.ora option. At that stage the spfile is not active and your > issuing Alter system set db_cache_size = 800m scope = [ memory | spfile | > both ] sid = * has no effect. You must create the spfile from the pfile and > then use the newly created spfile to use this "dynamic" parameter > persistent. Note the complexity involved - spfile allowed you to make the > changes to some parmeters using alter system persistent; but for all other > parametrs you are forced to use pfile. What happens if you ommit the > pfile=init.ora clause? The database will pickup the spfile, which will _not_ > have your changes. > > To fully appreciate the value of the spfile parameter, Oracle should have > allowed editing spfile directly and completely done away with pfile. > Splitting functionality across two different implementations adds to > difficulties, does not resolve them. I hope future versions of Oracle do > offer that functionality. It's not that difficult or unheard of, either. > Listener.ora, tnsnames.ora are all editable and also read by Net Assistant. > > just my .02 > > Arup Nanda > > > ----- Original Message ----- > To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2003 8:09 PM > > > > Spfile is shared and can be modified dynamically without bouncing the > > instances. > > > > Eg. Alter system set db_cache_size = 800m scope = [ memory | spfile | > both ] > > sid = * > > > > Without spfile, you can still make this change dynamically in memory, but > > you would have to manually update init.ora file to reflect your change. > > Spfile allows you to automatically capture these dynamic changes. > > > > Gerardo > > > > -----Original Message----- > > Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2003 4:45 PM > > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L > > > > > > And how, exactly? > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2003 7:29 PM > > > > > > > You'll appreciate spfiles if you're using RAC. > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > Sent: Tuesday, July 15, 2003 2:09 PM > > > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L > > > > > > > > > And create pfile from spfile; does a similar job. > > > > > > I'm rapidly beginning to think that spfiles are just not worth it. Now > > > how to reverse the policy decision having mandated them for 9i > > > installs :( > > > > > > Niall > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf > > > > Of Arup Nanda > > > > Sent: 15 July 2003 04:44 > > > > To: Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L > > > > Subject: Re: How to make SPFILE in sync with INIT.ORA ? > > > > > > > > > > > > As user sys, issue > > > > > > > > CREATE SPFILE FROM PFILE; > > > > > > > > This will create the spfile. You must have started the database > > > > using the pfile to use this command. > > > > > > > > HTH. > > > > > > > > Arup Nanda > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > To: "Multiple recipients of list ORACLE-L" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > Sent: Monday, July 14, 2003 10:59 PM > > > > > > > > > > > > > Guys, > > > > > > > > > > i have a 9iR2/win2k test instance. > > > > > i just renamed CONTROL01.CTL once and tried to start the instance. > > > > > > > > > > SQL>startup > > > > > But it gave a ORA-00205 error. > > > > > > > > > > so i removed CONTROL01.CTL from INIT.ORA file and started the > > > > > instance > > > > > SQL>startup pfile='d:\oracle\admin\pe92\pfile\init.ora' > > > > > Now it worked fine. > > > > > > > > > > BUT: > > > > > SQL>startup > > > > > This is not possible because the SPFILE still has > > > > CONTROL01.CTL in it. > > > > > > > > > > How do i make my SPFILE in sync with the INIT.ORA ? > > > > > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > Jp. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net > > > > > -- > > > > > Author: Prem Khanna J > > > > > INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > > > > > Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com > > > > > San Diego, California -- Mailing list and web > > > > hosting services > > > > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > - > > > > > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message > > > > > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and > > > > > in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or > > > > > the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may > > > > also send > > > > > the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net > > > > -- > > > > Author: Arup Nanda > > > > INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > > > Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com > > > > San Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting services > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > - > > > > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message > > > > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') > > > > and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB > > > > ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed > > > > from). You may also send the HELP command for other > > > > information (like subscribing). > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net > > > -- > > > Author: Niall Litchfield > > > INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com > > > San Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting services > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message > > > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in > > > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the > > > name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send > > > the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). > > > -- > > > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net > > > -- > > > Author: Molina, Gerardo > > > INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > > Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com > > > San Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting services > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message > > > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in > > > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the > > > name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send > > > the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). > > > > > -- > > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net > > -- > > Author: Arup Nanda > > INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com > > San Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting services > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message > > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the > > message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of > > mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP > > command for other information (like subscribing). > > -- > > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net > > -- > > Author: Molina, Gerardo > > INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com > > San Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting services > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message > > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in > > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L > > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may > > also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). > > > > > -- > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net > -- > Author: Arup Nanda > INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com > San Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting services > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may > also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). > -- > Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net > -- > Author: DENNIS WILLIAMS > INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com > San Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting services > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message > to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in > the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L > (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may > also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing). > -- Please see the official ORACLE-L FAQ: http://www.orafaq.net -- Author: Arup Nanda INET: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Fat City Network Services -- 858-538-5051 http://www.fatcity.com San Diego, California -- Mailing list and web hosting services --------------------------------------------------------------------- To REMOVE yourself from this mailing list, send an E-Mail message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (note EXACT spelling of 'ListGuru') and in the message BODY, include a line containing: UNSUB ORACLE-L (or the name of mailing list you want to be removed from). You may also send the HELP command for other information (like subscribing).
