Just because 'everyone at an event has bipolar or schizophrenia" no one free of ignorance and bigotry would assume an expression of anger meant mental instability.
On 3/6/06, Tree Fitzpatrick <[email protected]> wrote: > > Paul, I did read Birgitt's entire post. > > Just because all of the participants at Birgitt's event had bipolar or > schizophrenia, you had no reason to make the bigoted assumption that when on > member voiced anger and pain she was 'clearly mentally unstable'. > > It has never been the custom to publish private emails on this list. I > tried to approach Paul privately and he rebuffed my efforts. In the past, I > have gotten private emails from Paul that I found so offensive that I have > asked him to never write to me privately. > > I wrote to him, first, privately this evening because I knew that I tried > to confront his bigotry about mental illness online, he would be even > nastier than usual -- which is exactly what he has done. > > You had no right to publish my private emails online, Paul. You do not > own the copyright to my words, of course. I suppose you did so in an > attempt to show that I used profanity. Or maybe you hoped to continued your > bigotry???? > > > On 3/6/06, [email protected] <[email protected] > wrote: > > > > > > In a message dated 3/6/06 8:09:36 PM, [email protected]: > > > > In the same nasty note, Paul portrayed a woman that Birgitt told us > > about as 'clearly mentally unstable." > > > > Tree, > > > > Perhaps you should read Birgitt's post again, produced below, especially > > the first sentence or two. It was that to which I was referring. Sane > > people do not come up and scream at a leader because they could not make the > > choice to not participate. That is extreme individualism and mental > > instability, in my humble opinion. > > > > Further, your posts to me reek of another kind of individualism that > > feels it is OK to heap calumny, invective and profanity on another. Perhaps > > you have not heard that the use of profanity is the attempt of a weak and > > disordered mind to express itself forcefully. > > > > Since this is an unmoderated list anyone can post anything they wish. > > I, however, do not wish to be the recipient of such ranting and ravings so > > will be exercising the law of two feet. > > > > Paul > > > > Birgitt's Post: > > > > Years ago I was taught a big lesson. I facilitated an OST for about 300 > > people, all of whom were on medications, all of whom had bipolar disorder or > > schizophrenia. And all of whom were leaders in their communities and > > incredible people. The side effects of the medications and of their > > illnesses had an effect on all that happened in the 3 day event. They found > > a way of working around it all to achieve what they wanted to achieve. They > > were remarkable. I was deeply moved. At the closing, I did something that I > > had learned from Harrison. After the microphone had gone around the circle > > for comments, I had everyone stand up and hold hands as the start of a > > closing to the event. We then did a the exercise of paying attention to the > > energy inside of the circle of us, and then turning 180 degrees to feel that > > energy at our backs as we went out into the world. When it was all done, a > > woman came up to me and in a rage said "Do not ever do that to another human > > being again. I had had a wonderful time here until you asked us to touch. > > And then it was destroyed for me. I cannot touch another person. It is my > > story and it has roots in my childhood and in my illness. By asking us to > > hold hands, I had a choice...to be part of what the group was doing and > > feeling violated by it, or not participating and feeling awful about > > that....neither option was okay for me. YOU (and she shouted) have NO IDEA > > of what anyone's personal story is so you should never do this to a group > > again...to ask them to hold hands. You just don't know what is going on for > > someone and by asking me to hold hands, you invaded my space." > > > > *Tree's rants and raves to me, my replies, both public and by email:* > > > > Sent to me via email, not list) > > > > just because people on the oslist believe in the principles of open > > space, don't you think it about time you stopped taking advantage of > > their good nature and stopped shoving your extreme indvidualism down > > our throats? > > > > you get, right, that people put up with your bigoted, out-of-date crap, > > right? > > > > I am happy to tell the list what I really think of your recent, ugly > > words about a woman you have outrageously concluded had to be > > 'mentally unstable' but I consider you to be a big mentally unstable. > > . . so I won't. > > > > who among us has never voiced angry, anxious energy form time to time? > > who the fuck are you to declare someone mentally unstable? > > > > and do you have any clue that the oslist is used by professional > > facilitators to design real world events for real people and that, > > golly gee, Paul, many events have people that bring their > > individualism into a circle? are you so ignorant about process design > > and facilitation that you don't know a thing about it? > > > > go pop off somewhere else, you bigoted old pig > > -- > > Warmly, > > Tree Fitzpatrick > > Hearthkeeper > > > > (Reply by Paul Everett) > > > > Tree, > > > > I thought we had a respectful agreement not to correspond with each > > other. Why have you violated that? Think hard about what that implies > > related to your need to put me down. > > > > Paul > > > > WE did not have an agreement to not correspond with each other. > > > > But okay, then I will tell the list what I think of your recent, > > hideous, ugly, bigoted denigration of the mentally ill. > > > > And, by the way, fuck you. No respect from me. > > > > Tree > > > > I told you to leave me alone. If you got the impression that you had > > my respect, you misunderstood me. > > > > Tree > > > > (Paul's reply to the above two notes) > > > > Tree, > > > > Yes, and I did leave you alone. It is you who is not leaving me alone. > > I did not comment on your post. I expect you to afford me the same > > courtesy. As for respect, I was referring to the agreement, not you or me. > > I know there is a mutual dis-respect there. > > > > Paul > > > > Posted to the OS List: > > > > > > We were having a nice conversation on this list called 'a quiet time'. > > . . and then Paul posted a couple of nasty phrases that stung me. > > > > He wrote derisively about 'extreme individualism', making it feel to > > me, in a very ugly way, that he does not think it is okay for people > > to try to get their needs met. His derisive portrayal of examples of > > individuality as 'extreme individualism' left me thinking that he > > might not be a professional designer of human gatherings. . . at least > > not one with the value of inclusion. > > > > In the same nasty note, Paul portrayed a woman that Birgitt told us > > about as 'clearly mentally unstable." Ouch. That one seems even > > uglier. Who among us has never popped off, expressing anger in a less > > than optimal manner? It might not matter to most on this list but I > > do have a mental health disability and I am fed up with being made to > > feel like I have to tolerate ignorant, bigoted statements about the > > mentally ill. Like most bigotry, these kinds of statements usually > > stem from the speaker's lack of knowledge about what they are talking > > about. > > > > I have made a personal commitment to point out bigotry when I see it > > and I believe Paul's nasty comment of 'clearly mentally unstable' was > > bigotry. I know 'most people' routinely tolerate bigoted > > generalizaitons about people with mental health disabilities and when > > they do tolerate such bigotry, I always wonder why. why would anyone > > think people with mental health disabilities did not deserve the same > > absence of bigotry as anyone else? > > > > Sorry to bother the list with this but Paul's statements were, for me, > > shockingly offensive. > > > > Tree > > > > > > > > > -- > Warmly, > Tree Fitzpatrick > Hearthkeeper > -- Warmly, Tree Fitzpatrick Hearthkeeper * * ========================================================== [email protected] ------------------------------ To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of [email protected]: http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs: http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist
