Douglas I can appreciate you concerns (people eating, deeper conversations, etc.) -- but I can't for the life of me understand why the additional effort that you made would add substantively to the resolutions of the concerns in a way that wouldn't have just worked itself out naturally. People need to eat -- Do it! People want to talk deeply -- Go for it! Sounds like working much too hard!
Harrison Harrison Owen 7808 River Falls Drive Potomac, Maryland 20854 Phone 301-365-2093 Skype hhowen Open Space Training www.openspaceworld.com Open Space Institute www.openspaceworld.org Personal website www.ho-image.com OSLIST: To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives Visit: www.listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html -----Original Message----- From: OSLIST [mailto:osl...@listserv.boisestate.edu] On Behalf Of douglas germann Sent: Monday, October 05, 2009 10:00 PM To: osl...@listserv.boisestate.edu Subject: Re: aperiodic grid? Michael-- Some of the things we considered in setting the times, or would consider for an OS: o Some people had health necessity to eat promptly at Noon, so one segment had to end then o Time we got done with the intro and got groups chosen o Desire to start with a longer, deeper conversation o Need to allow ample time at lunch for exploring the outdoors (natural park setting) o Simply mixing up long and short times o Allowing people to choose whether their subject seemed to fit into a longer or shorter slot o Shorter time slots after lunch fit better to keep the attention up and give people more chance to meet with more people and get the exercise of moving around o Sometimes it is difficult to work out exact same time slots for a day--so instead of worrying about it all, we let the time slots fit the day: intro is done at 10:00 and lunch is at 12:00? Fine, do two 60 minute slots here and do the 75 or 90 minute slots later.... Whatever time shows up is the right time.... On Mon, 2009-10-05 at 09:52 -0500, Michael Herman wrote: > how did you decide on the times, doug? how does this sort of schedule > not presuppose somehting about the rhythm of the day that we can't > really know about in advance? Not necessarily, Michael. We could ask it another way: does rigid 90 minute sessions presume that everything can and will fit well in those time slots? Of course not. Neither will they fit in any pre-set time slots. > thinking another way, if the timing we post matters, then we'd best > get it right. which would have to be pretty lucky. and if it > doesn't matter, then why mess with it? Exactly. Do what creates the best feeling (not the same as what feels good--see Christopher Alexander, The Nature of Order) for the day, and don't worry about it any more. > so, even as i've wondered about such arrangements, and tried > occasionally (in minor ways, just to fit time slots to client > constraints on total time) i don't know how we could ever make any > standard at all. Right: No standards, other than what makes the day whole. > > for that matter, how do we decide between 1.5 and 1.0 and 0.75 and > other same-length slots, other than some gut sense of what wants to > happen, seems like it might work... or what will fit? Fit is part of it, and a big part. And, if you get your inviters together and see what seems to make the day more alive, more whole, you may be surprised to find that people will generally agree on the grid variations. > in short OS sessions we often have to choose between 1.5 and 1.0... a > 3.0-hour block forces a choice between 2 x 1.5 or 3 x 1.0 sessions. Or 1 at 1.0, 1 at 1.5 and 1 at 0.5. The 0.5 for me adds some liveliness to the mix, spice or punctuation. > i always thinik about this as a choice between depth and breadth. in > more established groups and older issues, i usually opt for 1.5s.. in > groups just forming, esp community groups with fewer connections, i > tend toward 1.0s, so that we get more issues raised and more people > meeting more others in more sessions. more voices. Yes, that speaks to me, too. > > > anyway, what drove the creation of this schedule and what do you think > happened differently because the times were all funny? > > m Funny? The humor, of course! <grin> Actually, the items listed above, as well as a desire to fit the activities. So the 75 and 30 were conversations, the first one about the inviting question of the retreat, the second asking for what threads people saw in the earlier conversation. The 90 was lunch and time to explore the grounds (a large park with many short trails through the woods nearby). The 15 (sorry for the typo) was for aerobic activities and singing; the 60 was for art (the children joined the adults for this activity); the 20 was a circle for reflections on the day. So we were fitting the activities to the appropriate time slots. Everything was pretty loose so that when things expanded there was time available, and when they got done earlier, that was fine, too. Kind of open space-like. :- Doug. > > > > -- > > Michael Herman > Michael Herman Associates > > http://www.michaelherman.com > http://www.ronanparktrail.com > http://www.chicagoconservationcorps.org > http://www.openspaceworld.org > > 312-280-7838 (mobile) > > > On Sat, Oct 3, 2009 at 10:15 AM, douglas germann > <76066....@compuserve.com> wrote: > Hi-- > > Anybody use an aperiodic grid for OS? > > Here's what I mean: In the big room at an OS meeting, we can > have many > simultaneous conversations going on at once, and the physical > space used > varies comfortably with the size and needs of the group. How > about time, > too? > > A couple of weeks ago I facilitated an annual retreat for a > Meeting of > Quakers. It was opening some space, but was not OS. > Nevertheless I think > I learned something: We made the conversation time slots > unequal: > > 10:15 75 min > 11:30 30 min > 12:00 90 min > 13:30 150 min > 13:45 60 min > 14:45 20 min > 15:05 Closing circle > > Has anyone tried something like this in OS? See any good in > it? I think > I want to try it again.... > > :- Doug. > > * > * > ========================================================== > osl...@listserv.boisestate.edu > ------------------------------ > To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, > view the archives of osl...@listserv.boisestate.edu: > http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html > > To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs: > http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist > * * ========================================================== osl...@listserv.boisestate.edu ------------------------------ To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of osl...@listserv.boisestate.edu: http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs: http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist * * ========================================================== osl...@listserv.boisestate.edu ------------------------------ To subscribe, unsubscribe, change your options, view the archives of osl...@listserv.boisestate.edu: http://listserv.boisestate.edu/archives/oslist.html To learn about OpenSpaceEmailLists and OSLIST FAQs: http://www.openspaceworld.org/oslist
