Dear Denise The difference is we are not in a developing country - I am well aware of the improtant roles TBAs/lay midwives etc play for the women in these countries !! In Australia, until the law changes, to call oneself a "midwife" one must meet the requirements whether we agree with it or not. Having read much about TBAs I am also well aware that they have required education from trained professionals to improve perinatal mortality and morbidity rates in these countries (described by Kitzinger in "The Midwife Challenge").
I totally agree that we can all learn from each other, I feel that I didn't quite get my thoughts across on this issue as well as I had wished. I again agree that these amazing women should have prior experience acknowledged, and they should be readily accepted into B Mid programmes - I was not aware that this wasn't happening (and find it quite ludicrous that it's not to be honest) As my argument is that as a profession, we must have standards to protect women and their babies; then to accept traditional midwives into these programmes, can only increase safe choices for women. On the subject of Ina May Gaskin - yes the ICM definition does exclude these women - in an interview I read recently with Ina May she was quoted as saying she believed that "certification is one important way of helping the public to know that the certified (direct-entry) midwife has passed an examination created by experienced, knowledge midwives and that she has demonstrated her mastery of requisite midwifery skills.....) www.wearsthebaby.com/articles/inamay. This is my argument that without any "formal" proof of a midwives abilities then how do we be sure she is a safe practitioner ? Doesn't it prevent Josephine Bloggs from down the road deciding oneday that she'll become a midwife, and with minimal experience, start attending women in childbirth - having "done" a few births with an experienced midwife she goes out on her own, thinking everything is great, as most birth normally ! Then she gets the flat baby or the PPH etc - (this is what I meant in my previous post, this was not directed at experienced lay midwives.) This is why we have the laws we do - call it control or whatever you like - and obviously some of these laws are not particulary current - Qld Gov is reviewing the Nursing Act at the moment - so everyone should pop in a submission and tell 'em what you want. ljg > Dear ljq and others, > It is sad though not suprising that the ICM definition of what is a midwife > can be quoted to exclude midwives such as InaMay Gaskin and Sue cookson and > many others who give so much not only to women but to other midwives! > > Imagine the difficulties of so many more women in developing countries if we > were to out law Traditional Birth Attendants? > I know from my time in PNG that failing to learn from them, infact they were > never mentioned 20 years ago and imposing western birthing practices > "midwifery" (now I know to be obstetric nursing) but then and now as > approved by ICM, for I see current midwives telling and doing the same to > women in hospitals here and elsewhere. > Anyway this registered midwife learnt the hard way to stop doing most of > those things I was taught in the UK to do, to explore what is possible and > the results have been the most wonderous births and babies! for me > inspiration has come from midwives who have not stayed or either not began > within the formal and limiting organisational structures. > > Also the history of midwifery makes me think Sue, and other lay midwives, > has not only a lot to offer and positive reasons why we should embrace and > seek to share the knowledge and experience of these strong, individual women > who are motivated to take a singular unsupported to be with women. > The regulation of our forebears was an introduction to not only control by > the medical and nursing fraternities but also resulted in the lose of most > midwifery knowledge. > Knowledge which we are still struggling to rediscover thanks again to > independent and divergent midwives and women who have struggled to reject > the medical limitations and interventions of birth which were taught to many > of us as normal and safe birthing practices!! > > It is also incongruent and sad in this age of Recognition of prior learning > in most colleges and universities that the program that our profession has > been so strong in intiating does not apply this principle particularly in > light of the new costiutional changes, NZ's example of partnership and what > it can produce as well as the new learning that is coming from the practice > of MIPPs and homebirth. > > It is not the act of a nurturing profession to be exclusive rather to > inclusive and seek common ground and partnerships toward mutual goals then > we will be advancing the goal of > "Peace at birth > Peace on Earth" > > Denise > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "ljg" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Friday, December 14, 2001 6:41 AM > Subject: Re: Fwd: Support homebirth on Thursday > > > > I must agree wholeheartedly with Trish - lets all remember the > International > > Confederation of Midwives definition of a Midwife > > > > "having been regularly admitted to a midwifery educational program, > duly > > recognised in the country in which it is located, has successfully > > completed the prescribed course of studies in midwifery and has acquired > the > > requisite qualifications to be registered and/or legally licensed to > > practise midwifery". > > > > > > > > > > > > > > While Claire Brassard may be a very competent birth attendant (I have no > > way of > > > knowing either way), and there may be other 'traditional' birth > attendants > > out > > > there, I cannot support such a protest until such time as we have > > recognition of > > > their knowledge and skills against the same criteria that formally > > prepared > > > midwives do. > > > > > > In all States and Territories and in most countries around the world the > > word > > > 'midwife' is a protected title. This means that only those people who > meet > > their > > > country's criteria to be recognised as a midwife can be called a midwife > > and can > > > practise under law as a midwife. The QNC has no option but to take this > > action > > > because neither it nor any other regulatory authority in Australia has > the > > power > > > to 'recognise' these women as midwives. > > > > > > I reiterate, this is irregardless of their level of knowledge, skill and > > > experience, and many of you would argue that some of these women would > run > > rings > > > around us formally educated midwives. That is as may be. But how does > > anyone > > > know for sure? With no standard against which they can be measured for > > minimum > > > requirements to competence? > > > > > > I therefore suggest that it is self-defeating to ask for an individual > to > > claim > > > the title 'midwife' and the right to practise as such when there is no > > statute, > > > and no caveat that will allow it. Rather it would be more to the point > to > > try to > > > create the process that would recognise 'other' ways of entering the > > profession > > > besides formal studies. USA managed this process. It will be costly and > > > time-consuming and might fail. But it is imperative to protect the right > > of > > > women to have a standard of midwife, because if the standard can vary > > greatly > > > across formal programs when there are all sorts of processes in place to > > enforce > > > them, then the standard for those without formal training and education > > can vary > > > even more greatly..... But we will never know because they are never > > measured. > > > And anyone could lay claim to the title 'midwife'. And that is not a > > situation I > > > would like to see happen. > > > > > > Women might want choices, but they want and deserve some assurance that > > the > > > choices they make are from safe alternatives. They must trust the > > profession to > > > regulate itself in their interests because not every woman has the > > resources to > > > investigate each birth attendant herself. This is actually working quite > > well, > > > and the processes put in place to begin national standardisation in the > > last > > > couple of years will assure that it works even better in the future. It > is > > hoped > > > women will have a greater say in how these processes work and what > > standards > > > will be met from now on. And that might include recognition of 'lay' or > > > 'traditional' birth attendants as midwives. > > > > > > Just my thoughts, and with greatest respect to individuals referred to, > > who may > > > indeed be the safest attendant possible. Trish David. > > > > > > Toni Cannard wrote: > > > > > > > Dear Ozmidwifery People, > > > > > > > > Claire Brassard, a traditional midwife, (read not a registered nurse > or > > > > midwife) is being banned from giving care to pregnant women by the > > > > Queensland Nursing Council (QNC). > > > > > > > > The e-mail that follows tells you how you can participate in a > Brisbane > > > > Protest tomorrow to give the press, media and pollies the following > > message: > > > > > > > > "Women want choices. Women who choose homebirth want the option of > > choosing > > > > a traditional midwife." > > > > > > > > Time to stand up and be counted - do we support women having free > choice > > or > > > > do we only support women choosing from the the options we would like > > them to > > > > have? > > > > > > > > Working for true choice, > > > > > > > > Toni Cannard > > > > Vice President > > > > AIMS Australia Inc (Association for Improvements in the Maternity > > Services - > > > > A consumer action group) > > > > > > > > >From: "Bruce Teakle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > > >>Subject: Support homebirth on Thursday > > > > >Date: Tue, 11 Dec 2001 15:21:50 +1000 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >Bruce Teakle > > > > >Lindsay Rd > > > > >Mt Glorious 4520 > > > > >Ph 07 3289 0231 > > > > > > > > > >Dear supporters of homebirth, > > > > > > > > > >You should know by now that Claire is going to court on thursday,13 > th > > of > > > > >december for the Supreme court to force her to cease caring for > > pregnant > > > > >women. > > > > > > > > > >There is a telephone process underway to get as many supporters to > the > > > > >Brisbane Court by 9.15 am on thursday morning as possible. Please > think > > > > >about who you know who might come to support our right to a "SAFE, > > > > >RESPONSIBLE, CARING" choice in birthing, and put out the word. It's > > just > > > > >fine if people hear more than once. > > > > > > > > > >The Theme > > > > > > > > > >There are several purposes to our gathering. > > > > >>1. To farewell Claire from our service, and grieve for the loss of > her > > > > >>care. > > > > >>2. To celebrate the spirit of midwifery and its long tradition. > > > > >>3. To bear witness to the action of the state in denying us Claire's > > care. > > > > >>4. To express our dissatisfaction with the poor service of our > > political > > > > >>servants in regard to respecting women's right of choice in > birthing. > > > > >Hopefully this will include some coverage by the media, and we are > > working > > > > >at getting that to happen. > > > > > > > > > >The Image > > > > > > > > > >We will look (and be) powerful, in a way which is most likely to make > > our > > > > > >political servants take notice. > > > > > > > > > >I propose that we behave somewhat like we are seeing off the queen > > (Claire > > > > >is not the queen, actually sometimes she's just very naughty. > > > > >However.....). For some of us Claire is the person who has given us > > the > > > > >sort of loving care we are seeking in birth. For others, she may > > symbolise > > > > >the care we have had from another midwife or even what we think women > > > > >deserve. What we express in love and respect for Claire is symbolic > of > > our > > > > >feelings about the >model of care we seek. > > > > > > > > > >So let us dress and perform as if we are farewelling the queen. > > Flowers, > > > > > >children, kisses, tears, families, our best clothes. > > > > > > > > > >Don't get me wrong, this isn't wet and weak, this is a demonstration > of > > the > > > > >state interfering in the lives of ordinary loving families, for no > > reason, > > > > >and that does not look good. > > > > > > > > > >The Routine > > > > > > > > > >We turn up at 9.15. We can't afford to be late. Don't forget this is > > the > > > > >city at peak hour, and driving in, and finding parking is a slow, > > terrible > > > > >and expensive business. Consider taking the train from somewhere > > > > >convenient. The court is equal distances from Central and Roma > street > > > > >stations, both are very close. > > > > > > > > > >We arrive, assemble outside the court building, and prepare for > > Claire's > > > > >arrival soon after 9.30. When Claire arrives she walks the aisle we > > prepare > > > > >for her, kissing and farewelling. This is when our photo > opportunities > > are, > > > > >when we all need to be there and prepared. > > > > > > > > > >She goes into court with her barrister and those of us who can go in > > > > >(without children) to witness the proceeding. The court proceedings > > > > >(everyone already inside and assembled) should start at 10.00 and > take > > 10 > > > > >minutes. > > > > > > > > > >Claire will then have finished her 22 years of renegade traditional > > > > >midwifery. > > > > > > > > > >What next? I don't know. I'll let my beard grow back, and we can get > > back > > > > >to normal (whatever that was) for a few weeks. > > > > > > > > > >We certainly have a big job to do in january, with the competition > > policy > > > > > >stuff and so on, and preparing to get back onto our > representative's > > > > >agenda's after their holidays. This is a big task we have embarked > on, > > and > > > > >we won't be letting go. > > > > > > > > > >See you there on thursday. > > > > > > > > > >Best wishes from Bruce. > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at > > http://explorer.msn.com/intl.asp. > > > > > > > > -- > > > > This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. > > > > Visit <http://www.acegraphics.com.au> to subscribe or unsubscribe. > > > > > > -- > > > This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. > > > Visit <http://www.acegraphics.com.au> to subscribe or unsubscribe. > > > > -- > > This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. > > Visit <http://www.acegraphics.com.au> to subscribe or unsubscribe. > -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit <http://www.acegraphics.com.au> to subscribe or unsubscribe.
