Well I think in a way being treated as not doing my part just for proposing that a basic course could be helpful is not motivating. honestly I started looking for information on line and then I went to the meetings because I feel a bit confusing starting in that way If one attend to the meetings you don´t have to convince nobody to use Pd, people are constantly looking for tools that can be useful for developing ideas, in my case I´m always curious about it. Don´t carry all the weight by yourself there must be somebody able to teach beginners in a regular way (thats also means money for the rent, of course).
Best Roberto El 18/09/2010, a las 15:55, João Pais escribió: >> I went to a couple of meetings but found them, as a beginner, not >> particularly motivating. >> I think, if you got some experience with Pd, work best because they are more >> focused on showing what you've already done. >> >> As a beginner, of course, you want to attend because you want to learn from >> the basics, the fundamentals, which is the reason why these meetings tend to >> become pseudo workshops, but from what I read in the forum, there is neither >> the desire nor the idea of doing it this way. >> Anyhow, showcasing is also good, because you get the picture of the >> potential and amplitude of pd. >> >> A good solution could be to provide a regularly basic course in Pd (every >> season, or something) in addition to specific workshops (I missed Servando´s >> one, pity!). >> >> This, I think, would be a healthy way to create a more participatory >> community. > > Hi Roberto (sorry, don't remember your face), > > I'll tell things from my point of view, which is the other opposite: from > being one of the more experienced people on those meetings, I don't find it > very motivating to go to the reunions to speak all the time and be a patch > fireman, and not getting much from it (apart from nice smiles) that I can use > myself. > > If you want a pd course thought by real people (you can get lots of materials > online), we can organise a real workshop, where someone speaks, you pay and > you go in. That isn't the point of these meetings, as I myself don't have the > time or the wish to be preparing or providing for "regular basic courses" > just like that (to put it bluntly, I must manage to pay my rent). > > Also, I myself don't go to those meetings to evangelise or convince people to > use Pd. If you want to use Pd, you need yourself to get into it, and be > prepared to spend lots of time with it. That's how you stop being a > "beginner" to be something else. And this leads into the other point, maybe > you didn't use the resources of the meetings to its fullest yet. We always > encourage people to sign up in the wiki (which you did), and also put in > suggestions of themes they want to see handled, which I don't see any - so > far only the "advanced people" put it their theme sugestions, so I think I > (we)'ve done our part. So, I don't know what are the motivating points that > you want to know. But since I'm not here to make sure you will use pd, you're > that one who has to tell that (to me or anyone else). So, paraphrasing > someone, don't ask yourself what these meetings can do for you, ask what you > can do for these meetings. If you are interested in a specific point, tell > the world what it is, and if someone there has experience with it, he might > come forward and show his patches around, or whatever he wants to. > > As I see it, healthy participation comes from both sides, don't expect people > to cater for you if you don't do your part of the bargain - we're not > providing a service, it's supposed to be a give and take situation. Or, if > you don't have any themes for now, go there, sit down and program, until you > find a problem. Then ask the guy on your side what does he know about it. If > he doesn't know much, ask the guy in front, and so on. > > And if this still isn't enough for you, then you might need a workshop with a > tutor - that's what you won't get in these meetings, at least not from me (of > course I don't speak for anyone else). > > João Pais Roberto Duarte +49 30 639 16015 +49 176 967 64274 Treptowerstr. 21, HH 4 Stock 12059 Berlin www.robertoduarte.de
_______________________________________________ [email protected] mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
