Awesome!
On May 18, 2016 8:01:24 PM PDT, Miller Puckette <[email protected]> wrote: >OK... I'm talked into it. Should appear (as a "-x" optional flag) once >0.47-1 >is ready. > >cheers >Miller > >On Wed, May 18, 2016 at 11:07:36PM +0200, Christof Ressi wrote: >> > Do you mean something like you have 1-baz.pd, 2-baz.pd, etc. and >then inside your [clone] abstraction you've got [$1-baz]? I suppose >this is a potential use case. >> >> Haha, sorry bad wording from my side, but this also an interesting >use case! >> >> I rather meant projects where everything is broken into modules which >themselves contain other modules etc. The first module in the tree >takes an ID as an *creation argument* and passes it down do its >submodules. Something like that. >> >> >> >> Gesendet: Mittwoch, 18. Mai 2016 um 22:40 Uhr >> Von: "Matt Barber" <[email protected]> >> An: "Christof Ressi" <[email protected]> >> Cc: "Miller Puckette" <[email protected]>, Pd-list <[email protected]> >> Betreff: Re: [PD] [clone]'s instance number >> >> BTW: I guess, it's mostly a design question, whether to work with >instance numbers inside abstractions and or to work with dispatching >via the inlets and outlets. However, I can think of at least two cases >where it's necessary to have immediate access to instance numbers >inside an abstraction: >> a) [send~ foo-$1] or [catch~ bar-$1] to disambiguate audio >inputs/outputs, because you can't set these two dynamically like [r~] >and [throw~] >> >> >> Where do you envision the corresponding [r~ foo-$1] or [throw~ >bar-$1] to reside? If it's in the same abstraction, then $0 ought to >work just as well. >> b) instantiate another abstraction by the instance number (nested >abstractions) >> >> >> Do you mean something like you have 1-baz.pd, 2-baz.pd, etc. and >then inside your [clone] abstraction you've got [$1-baz]? I suppose >this is a potential use case. >> >> So the current behaviour of [clone] (passing the instance number as >$1) can be important and very useful. The alternative mode I proposed >is mainly for convenience but I'm sure it would pay off in the long >run! >> >> > Gesendet: Mittwoch, 18. Mai 2016 um 18:45 Uhr >> > Von: "Miller Puckette" <[email protected]> >> > An: "Alex Norman" <[email protected][[email protected]]> >> >> > Cc: "Christof Ressi" ><[email protected][[email protected]]>, Pd-list ><[email protected][[email protected]]> >> > Betreff: Re: [PD] [clone]'s instance number >> > >> > OK... sounds like it's worth putting in. I guess with the >one-letter it >> > already takes (-s) I should also add something like a -e flag to >put the >> > number argument at the end of the list instead of the beginning, or >something >> > like that. >> > >> > cheers >> > Miller >> > >> > On Wed, May 18, 2016 at 07:20:29AM -0700, Alex Norman wrote: >> > > I see your point, the abstraction need not know it's instance >number since only the messages meant for it would be dispatched to it.. >If you don't care about using sends directed to a specific abstraction >then the $1 does nothing for you and if the flag to clone could ditch >the $1 to instance setting and just set the arguments to the >abstraction [clone -flag blah 20 1 2 3] makes 20 copies of blah with >args $1=1 $2=2.. You could use more of your existing abstractions as >is, using their args the same way with or without clone. >> > > >> > > I'm warming up to that idea. >> > > >> > > Alex >> > > >> > > On May 17, 2016 6:44:51 PM PDT, Christof Ressi ><[email protected][[email protected]]> wrote: >> > > >you can still disambiguate, because incoming messages are >dispatched by >> > > >the instance number and outgoing messages are prepended with it! >> > > > >> > > >My suggestion was mainly concerning all abstractions that work >with >> > > >inlets and outlets (as opposed to sends and receives), where you >> > > >basically pass a message and get something out. This could be >anything, >> > > >from simple message filtering to a perlin noise generator. Or >also >> > > >existing audio modules that work with a message inlet. If there >was >> > > >such a flag, you could take any of these abstractions as they >are, >> > > >control them separately by prepending the instance number and >route the >> > > >message output (or use the sum of the audio output). >> > > > >> > > >I guess, people will use [clone] mainly for voice management for >> > > >synthesizers, granular synthesis, complicated nested patches >etc., but >> > > >I also see a great potential for massive data generation by >using >> > > >existing simple abstractions and cloning them. >> > > > >> > > >Personally, I have many abstractions I would like to use with >[clone], >> > > >but either I'd have to rewrite them or make a wrapper >abstraction. It's >> > > >not a big deal, it's just that an alternative forwarding mode >would >> > > >provide some additional convenience (and could also encourage >other >> > > >usages for [clone]). >> > > > >> > > >Anyway, I can totally live without this feature, but would be >happy to >> > > >have it :-). >> > > > >> > > >> Gesendet: Mittwoch, 18. Mai 2016 um 02:35 Uhr >> > > >> Von: "Miller Puckette" <[email protected][[email protected]]> >> > > >> An: "Christof Ressi" ><[email protected][[email protected]]> >> > > >> Cc: Pd-list <[email protected][[email protected]]> >> > > >> Betreff: Re: [PD] [clone]'s instance number >> > > >> >> > > >> I'm not sure... would anyone ever use this feature? The patch >in >> > > >question >> > > >> would ahve to take arguments (if not, thre's no problem) but >not use >> > > >them to >> > > >> disambiguate the instances (because clone will set them all >equal >> > > >anyway). >> > > >> I have trouble imaginig anyone building a patch like that. >> > > >> >> > > >> cheers >> > > >> Miller >> > > >> >> > > >> On Wed, May 18, 2016 at 12:54:16AM +0200, Christof Ressi >wrote: >> > > >> > What do you think about the idea with a flag for changing >the way >> > > >creation arguments are forwarded? It would be really handy if >you could >> > > >write something like >> > > >> > [clone -flag 100 my-abstraction 5 6 7] and $1 $2 $3 will be >> > > >substituted by 5 6 7 instead of [N] 5 6. This way you could use >> > > >existing abstractions as they are, without the need for writing >a >> > > >wrapper abstraction to handle the creation argument forwarding. >> > > >> > >> > > >> > Christof >> > > >> > >> > > >> > > Gesendet: Dienstag, 17. Mai 2016 um 04:05 Uhr >> > > >> > > Von: "Miller Puckette" <[email protected][[email protected]]> >> > > >> > > An: "Jaime Oliver" ><[email protected][[email protected]]> >> > > >> > > Cc: "Christof Ressi" ><[email protected][[email protected]]>, Pd-list >> > > ><[email protected][[email protected]]> >> > > >> > > Betreff: Re: [PD] [clone]'s instance number >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > Cool, taking this suggestion. At least for now it will >work >> > > >either way, >> > > >> > > but it's much more readable with the abstraction name >first so I >> > > >changed the >> > > >> > > help file to invoke it that way. >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > cheers >> > > >> > > Miller >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > > On Wed, May 11, 2016 at 01:13:37PM -0400, Jaime Oliver >wrote: >> > > >> > > > Well, >> > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > > What would happen if instead of calling clone like: >> > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > > [clone 16 my-abstraction 1 5 9] >> > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > > we called it with: >> > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > > [clone my-abstraction 16 1 5 9] >> > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > > and then $1 seems quite appropriate. >> > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > > ? >> > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > > J >> > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > > > On May 11, 2016, at 12:17 PM, Christof Ressi >> > > ><[email protected][[email protected]]> wrote: >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > I agree that $1 is most natural! >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > However, what about adding an additional flag -foo for >> > > >[clone], which changes the way creation arguments are parsed? >> > > >> > > > > Passing -foo could ignore the object ID and rather >forward >> > > >creation arguments just as they are. >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > This wouldn't break the current behaviour of [clone], >but >> > > >provide some functionality to deal with ordinary abstractions >more >> > > >conveniently. >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > Christof >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > Gesendet: Mittwoch, 11. Mai 2016 um 18:06 Uhr >> > > >> > > > > Von: "Ivica Bukvic" <[email protected][[email protected]]> >> > > >> > > > > An: "Miller Puckette" <[email protected][[email protected]]> >> > > >> > > > > Cc: "IOhannes m zmoelnig" ><[email protected][[email protected]]>, Pd-list >> > > ><[email protected][[email protected]]>, "Christof Ressi" ><[email protected][[email protected]]> >> > > >> > > > > Betreff: Re: [PD] [clone]'s instance number >> > > >> > > > > What about having an if statement that detects clone >object >> > > >and if so, compensates for $2 discrepancy and assigns $1 to it >instead >> > > >and increments from there? This way the discrepancy is >internalized as >> > > >opposed to something user needs to deal with. >> > > >> > > > > -- >> > > >> > > > > Ivica Ico Bukvic, D.M.A. >> > > >> > > > > Associate Professor >> > > >> > > > > Computer Music >> > > >> > > > > ICAT Senior Fellow >> > > >> > > > > Director -- DISIS, L2Ork >> > > >> > > > > Virginia Tech >> > > >> > > > > School of Performing Arts – 0141 >> > > >> > > > > Blacksburg, VA 24061 >> > > >> > > > > (540) 231-6139 >> > > >> > > > > [email protected][[email protected]] >> > > >> > > > > >www.performingarts.vt.edu[http://www.performingarts.vt.edu][http://www.performingarts.vt.edu[http://www.performingarts.vt.edu]] >> > > >> > > > > >disis.icat.vt.edu[http://disis.icat.vt.edu][http://disis.icat.vt.edu[http://disis.icat.vt.edu]] >> > > >> > > > > >l2ork.icat.vt.edu[http://l2ork.icat.vt.edu][http://l2ork.icat.vt.edu[http://l2ork.icat.vt.edu]] >> > > >> > > > > >ico.bukvic.net[http://ico.bukvic.net][http://ico.bukvic.net[http://ico.bukvic.net]] >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > On May 11, 2016 11:50, "Miller Puckette" >> > > ><[email protected][[email protected]][[email protected][[email protected]]]> wrote:I >gave this some thought but >> > > >couldn't come up with anything more natural than >> > > >> > > > > the "$1" idea. It allows for changing the other >arguments >> > > >more easily than >> > > >> > > > > it would have been if the instance number were passed >last. >> > > >Also, somehow >> > > >> > > > > it felt more natural to have the instance number >first. >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > If there's interest in the idea, I could add >arrguments to >> > > >change the >> > > >> > > > > behavior (such as putting $1 last instead of first)... >> > > >Offhand I doubt that >> > > >> > > > > would get used much though. >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > cheers >> > > >> > > > > Miller >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > On Wed, May 11, 2016 at 05:26:21PM +0200, Christof >Ressi >> > > >wrote: >> > > >> > > > >> There's also a pitfall: additional creation arguments >for >> > > >the cloned abstraction will start with $2. >> > > >> > > > >> For example, in [clone 16 my-abstraction 1 5 9] '1' >will be >> > > >parsed as $2, '5' as $3, '9' as $4 etc. >> > > >> > > > >> No problem, if the abstraction was written for being >used >> > > >with [clone], but bad when cloning existing abstractions. >> > > >> > > > >> >> > > >> > > > >> I'm wondering if there could be a way to get the >abstraction >> > > >ID without messing up existing abstractions... Maybe have a >dedicated >> > > >object? >> > > >> > > > >> >> > > >> > > > >> For now, I think it's important to mention the >parsing of >> > > >additional creation arguments in the help file. >> > > >> > > > >> >> > > >> > > > >> Christof >> > > >> > > > >> >> > > >> > > > >>> Gesendet: Mittwoch, 11. Mai 2016 um 16:25 Uhr >> > > >> > > > >>> Von: "IOhannes m zmoelnig" >> > > >><[email protected][[email protected]][[email protected][[email protected]]]> >> > > >> > > > >>> An: >[email protected][[email protected]][[email protected][[email protected]]] >> > > >> > > > >>> Betreff: Re: [PD] [clone]'s instance number >> > > >> > > > >>> >> > > >> > > > >>> On 2016-05-11 16:18, Liam Goodacre wrote: >> > > >> > > > >>>> Would it be possible to access [clone]'s unique >instance >> > > >number from within the patch, a bit like a creation argument? >This >> > > >could be used to achieve differentiation between the >abstractions, ie. >> > > >if the abstraction contains "tabread4~ $-1.array" and the $-1 is >> > > >replaced with the instance number, then each instance could read >a >> > > >different file. Of course there are other ways of doing this, >but it >> > > >would be neat to do it with clone, and I'm wondering if there's >a way. >> > > >> > > > >>> >> > > >> > > > >>> >> > > >> > > > >>> isn't this what $1 is already doing in clone's >instances? >> > > >> > > > >>> >> > > >> > > > >>> >> > > >> > > > >>> fgasdmr >> > > >> > > > >>> IOhannes >> > > >> > > > >>> >> > > >> > > > >>> _______________________________________________ >> > > >> > > > >>> >[email protected][[email protected]][[email protected][[email protected]]] >mailing list >> > > >> > > > >>> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> > > >>https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list[https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list][https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list[https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list]] >> > > >> > > > >>> >> > > >> > > > >> >> > > >> > > > >> _______________________________________________ >> > > >> > > > >> >[email protected][[email protected]][[email protected][[email protected]]] >mailing list >> > > >> > > > >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> > > >>https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list[https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list][https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list[https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list]] >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > _______________________________________________ >> > > >> > > > > >[email protected][[email protected]][[email protected][[email protected]]] >mailing list >> > > >> > > > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> > > >>https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list[https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list][https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list[https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list]] >> > > >> > > > > >> > > >> > > > > _______________________________________________ >> > > >> > > > > [email protected][[email protected]] mailing >list >> > > >> > > > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> > > >>https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list[https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list] >> > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > > >> > > >> > > > _______________________________________________ >> > > >> > > > [email protected][[email protected]] mailing list >> > > >> > > > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> > > >>https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list[https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list] >> > > >> > > >> > > >> > >> > > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > > >> > [email protected][[email protected]] mailing list >> > > >> > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> > > >>https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list[https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list] >> > > >> >> > > > >> > > >_______________________________________________ >> > > >[email protected][[email protected]] mailing list >> > > >UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >> > > >>https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list[https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list] >> > >> >> _______________________________________________ >> [email protected][[email protected]] mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list[https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list] >> >> _______________________________________________ >> [email protected] mailing list >> UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list > >_______________________________________________ >[email protected] mailing list >UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> >https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
_______________________________________________ [email protected] mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> https://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
