>> So I'm now leaning on actually disregarding ~/Library as a good choice for creating and using as an external destination...
+1 on this... i just had a classroom of students navigate to ~/Library and create ~/Library/Pd .... its quite a pain to teach some of these basic skills. for some reason this particular class had security concerns with create such a folder (maybe because last assessment we got into a lengthy anonymity/snowden/darkweb/hacking discussion).... anyway was this not all discussed and decided upon in pdx dev days? i am not sure about deken new functions but unless its in millers core it doesn't matter seeing thats where i have students download from. BTW arduino and processing also both install libraries in: ~/Documents and as porres might say "just saying" m On Sat, Mar 4, 2017 at 6:24 PM, Alexandre Torres Porres <[email protected]> wrote: > Oh, and it's not like Pd doesn't already write stuff in "~/Library", it > actually does create files in "~/Library/preferences", so it's not like > it's a sacred ground it can't touch... I'm still yet to understand what is > the issue of Pd creating a folder in here... > > Though I can agree it is a rather unusual place to go. Most softwares > won't do it, and the reason this is being discussed is just that Pd happens > to have that folder as a standard path in the first place... so it's coming > from Pd for some reason. Now, I can see most softwares prefer to use other > folders in the user area, outside this hidden ~/Library folder. For > instance, audiosculpt went for ~/Applications. Max and Native Instruments > went for ~/Documents. The place to install externals for Max is in > ~/Documents/Max/Packages. > > There's also the "shared" folder. I see Max and Native Instruments there > too. So if you want to install something for all users, that folder seems > to be the one to go. > > So I'm now leaning on actually disregarding ~/Library as a good choice > for creating and using as an external destination... not sure yet why > there's a resistance it's a bad place to go... but if this is why, well, > maybe a better option like these other folders would do. > > That would actually work and solve thew other problems I was raising, > where you can't navigate to the ~/Library folder if you want to add it in > your "Path". > > This is all for Mac OS of course, and we should check the options for > other systems. > > cheers > > 2017-03-04 19:59 GMT-03:00 Alexandre Torres Porres <[email protected]>: > >> 2017-03-04 15:54 GMT-03:00 Roman Haefeli <[email protected]>: >> >>> >>> I really can't share your notion that things are complex from a user >>> perspective. You can use Deken out of the box now. >> >> >> Yes, with the new feature you can, and you couldn't before! My point is >> not that it won't work, but that it can still be further improved beyond >> the advancement being made right now. >> >> >> >>> On Windows >= 7 and on any Linux I know the only user writable option >>> is the user specific folder. I know now this is not true on Macs >>> depending on what check boxes you checked in the system preferences for >> >> the user. >> >> >> It works out of the box for macs, you don't need to set anything up, >> that's my experience... but I guess you can alter the system and prevent it. >> >> So, our thing is that Pd has all these folders as "Standard Paths" but >> not all are usable or writeable. Actually, besides the application folder, >> they're not even created by the software. So we need to find a common >> ground and it seems to be the user folder. So that's a good option for a >> default setting that's consistent for all operating systems. Good. >> >> >>> As far as I know, most software doesn't write any user specific stuff >>> at installation time. How should it know which users are going to use >>> the software and what happens if a user is added _after_ installation? >>> >> >> If a user is installing the software, then it can deduce that this user >> is going to use the software. In the same ~/Library folder here on my mac >> is where the */Audio* folder is, including the *MIDI Drivers* and >> *Plug-ins*. All plugins installers write in here and install the plugins >> you can use in Ableton Live, for instance. And Ableton Live has no problem >> in searching for the plugins over there. That's an example... >> >> It totally makes sense to create any directories and/or write files >>> when they are actually needed. Pd doesn't need /Users/alex/Library/Pd so >>> why should it create it? >> >> >> How come it doesn't need it? Isn't it one of Pd's Standasr Paths for >> starters?More over, isn't the folder we're realizing is the only writeable >> and best option for all platforms? What do you mean? Sorry, I don't get it. >> >> >>> It's hard if you want to do specific stuff that requires special >>> knowledge. >> >> >> All that is hard can be made easier... I just suggested a few solutions. >> >> >>> I don't see how it is hard if you want to just download and >>> use an external. >> >> >> There are different options for downloading and using an external. Right >> now, this is not well documented or made easy to achieve. Ok, we got one >> step further with this update and at least we can download and use it. >> >> Having said that, loading stuff from libraries correctly is still >>> complex, more complex than necessary, in my opinion. >>> >> >> great, then we're on the same track after all. >> >> >>> I wish calling the library by name would be enough, regardless of its >>> internal layout. >>> >> >> +1 on that >> >> cheers >> > > > _______________________________________________ > [email protected] mailing list > UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management -> https://lists.puredata.info/ > listinfo/pd-list > > -- ____________________ m.e.grimm, m.f.a, ed.m. syracuse u., tc3 megrimm.net ____________________
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