J. C. O'Connell wrote:
There is only one meaning of the word "FALSE"
as far as I know. NOT TRUE.
Your logic is flawed. There are many more states than just TRUE or FALSE.
Condition One:
I say a camera is a Pentax. It either IS or it IS NOT. So you can say
my statement is TRUE or FALSE.
I say a camera is working. It either IS or IS NOT working. So you can
say my statement is TRUE or FALSE. Right? Maybe.
Condition Two:
I went out and took pictures with the camera. From my point of view, it
works. I'm satisfied.
You took the camera to a shop and they tested the shutter speeds, and
they're off. You're not satisfied. From your point of view, it does
not work.
Who is the liar? Do I owe you a refund? Should I give you a discount?
How much is appropriate? Who decides?
Condition Three:
I say a camera is in 'great cosmetic shape.' You say it is not. Now,
which statement is TRUE and which is FALSE? Does the buyer always get
to decide? You mean the seller has to know what every potential buyer
might call the cosmetic condition? How can that be right?
So you tell me - is every statement TRUE or FALSE?
What you don't seem to understand is that there
are many instances where an item listing has
made false claims as a matter of FACT, not
opinion, and that is what I am mostly reffering to
(there are cases where even opinion could be
argued too but that's another issue for another day.)
If you disagree, then it is fact, if not, then it is opinion. I got that.
i.e you buy a size XL T-shirt and is says right
on label size L. things like that. "working"
items that don't work, Used items (obviously worn) sold
as new, sealed items delivered unsealed, complete
items actually missing parts, etc, etc
I could go on and on. Just because these were sold
at ebay auciton doesn't mean the buyers don't
deserve full refunds or cant renegoiate prices
paid which is what you claimed to be the case just
because they were sold in auction format. That isnt
true, its false.
Nope. If I am a seller and I have ten thousand shirts to sell and they
say XL in them and I sell them as L, then I'm wrong and you deserve a
refund. If I sell them as XL and you find out that XL meant XL in
Japan, which is M here in the USA, then I made an honest mistake, you
should get a refund. If I sell them as XL and they are XL according to
the manufacturer, but you're a fat bastard and don't want to admit that
you're actually a XXL, then too bad for you. And by the way - try
looking at sizes some time. There is no real standard on M, L, and XL
between manufacturers. They're more or less in agreement, but it's
still a pretty loose standard. Great example you gave - shows how wrong
you are.
And this is huge, it DOES NOT matter whether the
person lied or was mistaken if the claims were false,
if it did every crook out there would just lie and
then "play dumb" like he didn't know when he really
did.
Yes it does. Read 'mens rea' and 'intent' sometime in a law
dictionary. Crooks do lie and pretend they didn't know. It's sad, but
it happens. You could punish the innocent with the guilty, but we don't
do that in the US - we presume innocence unless proven otherwise.
A mistake is no better than a lie, the seller
has to take responsibility for truth in their listings.
Nope. Only intentional deception and direct statements such as 'this is
new' as opposed to 'I think this looks great', which can't be parsed in
any legalistic way unless you can prove in court that I *don't* think it
looks great. Of course, I'll never admit that, so you lose. Point is -
whether the seller is being honest or not, if they say 'I think it looks
great' it doesn't mean anything you can demand a refund for.
If they were mistaken then they have to refund/renoegoiate
with the seller. The seller made the mistake in that
case, not the buyer...
No, they don't. And regnegotiating is right out - or everyone would bid
whatever they wanted to get the item, knowing that they could
renegotiate later after they make up a bunch of 'problems'.
Tell me this - if I sell a camera as 'junk' and you buy it and find out
it is 'mint', do you owe ME money? Can I come back to you after the
sale and say "Hey, wait a minute - you got a better deal than I
intended, because the description was not correct. Give me more
money." Will that fly with you? No, because the deal is over. Offer,
acceptance, consideration - we call that a contract. No renegotiation.
