"Competition for public schools"? You can't operate a public school system on a business model. If businesses don't work out, they can just go out of business, shut down.
Public schools don't exactly have that "luxury". Voucher systems suck money away from public schools, making it even harder for them to do the job we (and students!) need them to do. In essence it is a subsidy for private schools and to families who are already well off. This insidious process is disguised and whitewashed by using terms like "freedom of choice" when in fact rich people always have the choice of where to send their kids while vouchers take away the "choice" of impoverished students to have a quality education. Want to help public education? This is not the way to do it. Cheers, frank --- Original Message --- From: Paul Stenquist <[email protected]> Sent: April 7, 2013 4/7/13 To: "Pentax-Discuss Mail List" <[email protected]> Subject: Re: Posting Photos of Street Art can get you arrested On Apr 7, 2013, at 1:19 AM, Paul Sorenson <[email protected]> wrote: > Interspersed... > > On 4/6/2013 7:26 PM, Paul Stenquist wrote: >> Voucher systems provide education financing but allow parents to make >> their own choice. The selections are generally many and no one is >> compelled to attend a religious institution. Thus, they don't really >> fit the definition of a public school. > > I have no problem with parents choosing to send their children to private or > religious schools - *Choosing* being the operative word. My point is that > they have the option of attending a public school and if they choose a > private school they know there is an obligation to pay tuition. The > taxpayers do not/should not have an obligation to subsidize them. But if we establish a charter school system to provide competition for our failing public schools, offering choices seems reasonable. I have no problem with some of my tax dollars going to a Muslim school or a school that preaches the modern religion of secularism, as long as those schools are succeeding and other options are available. Freedom is about options. > > >> >> Wisconsin is one of only a few states that allow vouchers to be used >> in religious schools. The Wisconsin Supreme Court okayed that in >> 1998, but it's expected that the U.S. Supreme Court will eventually >> rule on it. I suspect they will affirm the state court's decision, in >> that federal student loans have always been available at religiously >> affiliated universities. That doesn't make those universities "public >> schools." > > Apples and oranges...vouchers are paid directly to the school as state aid > with no requirement for any reimbursement - a gift from the taxpayers. > Student loans are just that...loans that the student can use for tuition as > well as other educational items and that come with a payback obligation on > the part of the student. > >> >> In regard to traditional public schools being better than or equal to >> charter schools that's largely a myth perpetrated by teacher unions >> -- of which I was once a member. In Detroit, the charter schools and >> religious schools far outperform the public schools. Nationally, the >> margin is thinner, but overall, the charter schools have an edge. >> That's not to say that there aren't bad charters. There are. But the >> competition of the marketplace eventually weeds them out. Public >> schools don't have to compete. That's part of the problem. >> >> Paul On Apr 6, 2013, at 7:58 PM, Paul Sorenson <[email protected]> >> wrote: >> >>> It depends on your definition of a "Public School". If it's a >>> school offered/run by a public entity, then I'd agree that thy are >>> non-denominational. However, the big push in Wisconsin by both a >>> Republican governor and a Republican legislature is for so-called >>> "voucher schools" whereby private and religious schools are >>> partially funded by taxpayer money. >>> >>> The argument for that is "they provide a better education than the >>> public schools". Unfortunately, the research shows that they don't >>> perform any better and in some cases don't provide as good an >>> education. >>> >>> I don't know if that meets the definition of separation of church >>> and state, but it sure as hell is not non-denominational. >>> >>> -p >>> >>> On 4/6/2013 6:32 PM, Paul Stenquist wrote: >>>> I've never seen a United States public school that has religious >>>> affiliation. I would think it would be unconstitutional. >>>> >>>> Paul On Apr 6, 2013, at 7:28 PM, Stan Halpin >>>> <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Apr 6, 2013, at 7:23 PM, Paul Stenquist wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> All U.S. public schools are non-demominational. >>>>>> >>>>>> Paul via phone >>>>> >>>>> Except in parts of the South and Midwest. >>>>> >>>>> stan >>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> On Apr 6, 2013, at 7:09 PM, Bob W <[email protected]> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> On 6 Apr 2013, at 16:01, Ann Sanfedele <[email protected]> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> In an effort to inject a bit of levity into this >>>>>>>> discussion.. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 4/6/2013 10:12, Bipin Gupta wrote: >>>>>>>>> ... I am a Hindu, but went to a Roman Catholic Boarding >>>>>>>>> Public School, so I fully understand Western Values. >>>>>>>>> ... >>>>>>>> What's wrong with this sentence? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Spurious logic. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> B >>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List [email protected] >>>>> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE >>>>> from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow >>>>> the directions. >>>> >>>> >>> >>> -- Being old doesn't seem so old now that I'm old. >>> >>> -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List [email protected] >>> http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from >>> the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the >>> directions. >> >> > > -- > Being old doesn't seem so old now that I'm old. > > -- > PD -- PDML Pentax-Discuss Mail List [email protected] http://pdml.net/mailman/listinfo/pdml_pdml.net to UNSUBSCRIBE from the PDML, please visit the link directly above and follow the directions.
