BODY { font-family:Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;font-size:12px; }I
would disagree. The falling of the tree is a full Sign
[O-R-I]....with the actual fall as the Dynamic Interpretant. The
wind-taking-down-the-tree might by a Dynamic Object to the
tree...which then reacts by falling [DI]. 

        But within the bird, what affects the senses of the bird - is that
loud sound. That is the external Dynamic Object to that situation.
The Immediate Object is whatever sensual data is felt within the bird
from that sound.  The Representamen is a process of mediating this
sensate data into an interpretation [II and DI]. 

 On Sun 04/02/18  4:08 PM , Jon Alan Schmidt
 Helmut, List:
 In my view, we can indeed take the loud sound to be the
Representamen, as I initially suggested--noting again that my
definition differs significantly from Edwina's.  This leads to a
different analysis in which the Dynamic Object is the falling of the
tree that causes the sound, with the other terms reassigned
accordingly.  Sign-action is mediation, even though the Sign itself
is indeed the First Correlate of the genuine triadic relation that
has the Object as its Second Correlate and the Interpretant as its
Third Correlate (cf. EP 2:290; 1903). 
Jon Alan Schmidt - Olathe, Kansas, USAProfessional Engineer, Amateur
Philosopher, Lutheran [1] - [2]  
 On Sun, Feb 4, 2018 at 1:51 PM, Helmut Raulien  wrote:
  Edwina, isn´t mediation (thirdness) a matter of the interpretant
(thirdness), not the representamen? Well,  I see representamen,
object, interpretant as 1ns, 2ns, 3ns, which perhaps you don´t. Ok,
representamen is also the sign, which is thirdness, because it
includes all. This is difficult. Maybe the solution lies in the
semiosis, when the interpretant (3ns) becomes a representamen (1ns)
again? I don´t know. Have to ponder, get back later. Or do you have
an idea what I am missing? Best, Helmut 04. Februar 2018 um 20:19 Uhr
 Von: "Edwina Taborsky" 
        Helmut - I'll disagree. You are missing the triadic semiosic process
of O-R-I. You are missing the process of mediation between the Object
and the Interpretant - which is the action carried out by the

        Therefore - the Representamen is not 'the loud sound' -  

 On Sun 04/02/18 2:13 PM , "Helmut Raulien" [5]
sent:    Jon, Edwina, List, I think: - The representamen is the loud
sound, and everything connected with it in the situation (as the
representamen is also the sign, so including all following points
too) - The dynamical object is that, what the bird initially feels to
be the source of the loud sound, as this (imaginary) source really
(not imaginary) is, and as it is in the concepts of all other birds
and all other creatures, - The immediate object is what is initially
arisen (imagined) in the bird´s mind by the loud sound for being its
source, - The immediate interpretant is the reason the bird assumes
having to fly away, - The dynamical interpretant is really avoiding
the (still imaginary) danger by flying away, - The final interpretant
is the real benefit achieved by the bird, defined by what would really
have happened if the bird had not flown away. This was a quick shot.
Now I guess, maybe there is a pattern of combinations of "imaginary"
and "real"... Best, Helmut 

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