louis, you have not been listening at all. i have confronted certain impasses and difficulties in my activism over the years, which i then sought out readings for some wider sense of explanation - this i have said countless times.. i'm not a fan of butler's, but if you think this is mumbo-jumbo' (and i hate to bring up the age thing), but there are some young kids (15) i know who understand this more than they understand marx - it speaks to them in ways which you might not understand, but to them what you find intelligible is 'mumbo-jumbo' - and that is an unfortunate term for something you can't understand.... butler is not an identity theorist. you are. when you speak of the need for self-determination, you advance a whole set of assumptions, assumptions which are manifested in practice, in activism, and in the forms of organization, about the SELF that you argue needs to be SELF-determined. angela