I appreciate very much what Doyle had to say about the listserv not
functioning as a place for collaborative work. That gets closer to my point
than what I actually said. 

In the past, I've made connections through Pen-l that have led to two major
pieces of collaborative work and several other strands that fed into those
two big ones. That makes it even more puzzling to me that the drift seems to
be ever more toward tit-for-tat set pieces and arcane gossip. I would wonder
why pen-l couldn't mature and possibly take stock of its own legacy and try
to build on that.

I think what Yoshie said, "it goes without saying" is apt. If you'll pardon
the expression, it is also "easier said than done." It is a discipline to
train ourselves to say that which goes without saying. Only then will we
discover why it has gone without saying.



Tom Walker
Bowen Island, BC
604 947 2213

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