CB:> Yea, I'm trying to think of a Marxist on these lists or elsewhere who thinks capitalists are one quarter or 40 quarters from collapsing themselves into socialists. Can somebody _name_ a Marxist who thinks that capitalists will collapse "on their own" without a massive ( tens of millions ), class-conscious and organized group of workers to overthrow them ? All Marxists I've ever heard speak on the issue hold that a big economic crisis in capitalism only provides an opportunity ( and danger of fascism) for a communist movement to take state power, not that the capitalists on their own, because of a crisis , would turn to socialism.
>I think the "Marxist" who think capitalists will automatically turn themselves into socialists is one of those "Marxists" who Marx was not one of....< this is right. the "Marxists" who see an automatic fall of capitalism are more like the utopian Edward Bellamy who saw the centralization of capital producing a big monopoly which people would see as totally irrational, so that they'd turn it into a undemocratic-but-benevolent planned socialism. and there would be no resistance from the monopoly. JD
