I didn't post up jwz's grumblings to kick off Yet Another Java vs Perl Argument. Nor did I post it to point out that he's a curmudgeonly young fart (which he is, but that's not a Bad Thing). Its there because he made alot of good points which apply to Perl. Keep the discussion focused there, on Perl and how we're going to improve it. Not on jwz or Java, they're incidental. Should we put bignums in the core? Is it worth the hassle to do Everything-An-Object? Macros? Can we declare it a Design Decision that scalars are going to be big (to a system programmer's shrunken eye)? etc... -- Michael G. Schwern <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> http://www.pobox.com/~schwern/ And it's made from all-natural baby skin, so you know it's good for the environment. http://www.goats.com/archive/000606.html