On 04/03/2016 09:41 PM, Peter Geoghegan wrote:
Hi Tomas,
3) replacement_sort_mem GUC

I'm not quite sure what's the plan with this GUC. It was useful for
development, but it seems to me it's pretty difficult to tune it in practice
(especially if you don't know the internals, which users generally don't).

I agree.

So I think we should either remove the GUC entirely, or move it to the
developer section next to trace_sort (and removing it from the conf).

I'll let Robert decide what's best here, but I see your point.

Side note: trace_sort actually is documented. It's a bit weird that we
have those TRACE_SORT macros at all IMV. I think we should rip those
out, and assume every build enables TRACE_SORT, because that's
probably true anyway.

What do you mean by documented? I thought this might be a good place is:


which is where trace_sort is documented.

I do think that replacement selection could be put to good use for
CREATE INDEX if the CREATE INDEX utility command had a "presorted"
parameter. Specifically, an implementation of the "presorted" idea
that I recently sketched [1] could do better than any presorted
replacement selection case we've seen so far because it allows the
implementation to optimistically create the index on-the-fly (if that
isn't possible, throw an error), without a second pass over tuples
sorted on tape. Nothing needs to be stored on a tape/temp file *at
all*; the only thing that is stored externally is the index itself.
But this patch doesn't add that feature, which can be worked on
without the user needing to know about replacement_sort_mem in 9.6.

So, I'm not in favor of ripping out the replacement selection code,
but think it could make sense to effectively disable it entirely for
the time being (with some developer feature to turn it back on for
testing). In general, I share your misgivings about the new GUC,


I'm wondering whether 16MB default is not a bit too much, actually. As
explained before, that's not the amount of cache we should expect per
process, so maybe ~2-4MB would be a better default value?

The obvious presorted case is where we have a SERIAL column, but as I
mentioned even that isn't helped by RS. Moreover, it will be
significantly hurt with a default maintenance_work_mem of 64MB. Your
int4 CREATE INDEX cases clearly show this.

BTW couldn't we tune the value automatically for each sort, using the
pg_stats.correlation for the sort keys, when available (increasing the
replacement_sort_mem when correlation is close to 1.0)? Wouldn't that
improve at least some of the regressions?

Maybe, but that seems hard. That information isn't conveniently
available to the executor/tuplesort, and as we've seen with CREATE
INDEX int4 cases, it's far from clear that we'll win even when there
definitely is presorted input. Replacement selection needs more than a
simple correlation to win, so you'll end up building a cost model with
many new problems if this is to work.

Sure, that's non-trivial and definitely not a 9.6 material. I'm also wondering whether we need to do choose replacement_sort_mem at planning time, or whether it could be done in the executor based on actually observed data ...


Tomas Vondra                  http://www.2ndQuadrant.com
PostgreSQL Development, 24x7 Support, Remote DBA, Training & Services

Sent via pgsql-hackers mailing list (pgsql-hackers@postgresql.org)
To make changes to your subscription:

Reply via email to