The convention for exiting anything that requires saving is using a Yes/No/Cancel interaction.
Yes: Exit and save. No: Exit without saving. Cancel: Do nothing. Regards, Esteban A. Maringolo On Thu, Jul 4, 2019 at 10:46 AM Ben Coman <[email protected]> wrote: > > On Thu, 4 Jul 2019 at 19:37, Torsten Bergmann <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > Hi, > > > > around 20 days ago the order of menu items in the Pharo world menu were > > munged up in the standard Pharo 8 > > image for whatever reasons. "Safe" was on first position and not grouped > > with other "Save ..." items anymore as it was > > in the past. This was noted by Alexandre Bergel and others on Discord. > > > > I fixed the order in the following PULL REQUEST > > https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo/pull/3529 > > with the menu ending up looking like this: > > > > !-------------------- > > ! SETTINGS > > !-------------------- > > ! SAVE > > ! SAVE AS > > ! SAVE AND QUIT > > !-------------------- > > ! QUIT > > !-------------------- > > > > having added by intention an additional divider between > > - the more safe options to store the image (secure) > > - the unsafe quit where one can loose changes in the image (insecure if > > you just quit) > > > > I know that "SAVE AND QUIT" and "QUIT" also might belong somehow together > > as both exit the image > > - but the diver should separate the more secure options from the more > > insecure options. > > > > > > Now today the divider was removed again using > > https://github.com/pharo-project/pharo/pull/3738 > > from Cyril Ferlicot mentioning it as "unwanted" - so now the menu looks > > like this: > > > > !-------------------- > > ! SETTINGS > > !-------------------- > > ! SAVE > > ! SAVE AS > > ! SAVE AND QUIT > > ! QUIT > > !-------------------- > > > > as it was back in Pharo 7. > > > > As I'm someone who is mousing around very quickly in the past it often > > happened to me that while I wanted to > > really "SAVE AND QUIT" I hit accidentally the "QUIT" button directly below > > - leaving me in a state where I had > > to recover or reapplying changes afterwards. > > > > So using the additonal divider between the three "safe my data" options and > > the "just leave" was intentional and to > > me makes some sense: from the point of view of grouping, visually and from > > clicking behavior. > > > > I guess Cyril Ferlicot wanted to restore how it looked in Pharo 7 or had > > other reasons why he prefers the menu to > > look like in the second picture. > > > > I know it is not a big thing - but nonetheless: It would be good if others > > could write which option > > > > a) WITH DIVIDER (as in first picture to separate safe from unsafe > > options) or > > b) WITHOUT DIVIDER (as in second picture to stay like it was back in > > Pharo 7) > > Separating dangerous options from the safe options seems a good idea - > Both for physical jitter and also cognitively. > Even though Quit presents a confirmation dialog, I've had > cognitive-fails clicking YES instead of NO**. > so WITH DIVIDER + 1 > > Further, I personally use Save much more often than Settings. > I'd prefer Save on the top line and Settings above Quit > I advocated this prior to midway through Pharo 7 but got no response. > It would provide even greater separation. > > Some Settings menu-item placement examples... > https://www.top-password.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2017/04/chrome-menu.png > https://ntopology.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/FileMenu.png > https://ggnome.com/wiki/images/d/d6/FileMenuWin.png > https://www.mozenda.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/AgentBuilder-File-Settings-CursorHighlight-Arrow-274x300.png > > cheers -ben > > > **P.S. I'm generally opposed to YES/NO buttons. Its easy to invert > logic when your in a hurry. > A confirmation dialog QUIT/STAY is much more explicit. > Rule #1 ==> > https://uxmovement.com/buttons/5-rules-for-choosing-the-right-words-on-button-labels/ >
