I have a tree in the front yard that suffers from Dutch elm disease!!! You know, I suffer from amnesia and this is deja vu all over again....I think I have already forgotten this! Mike oldcranky -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.oldcrank.org/pipermail/phono-l/attachments/20041005/49963048/attachment.html From [email protected] Tue Oct 5 12:52:26 2004 From: [email protected] (Bruce Mercer) Date: Sun Dec 24 13:09:51 2006 Subject: [Phono-L] Dutch References: <[email protected]> Message-ID: <[email protected]>
> Message: 3 > Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 18:15:57 -0400 > From: "Dan Kjeldgaard" <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Racial Inferences (was Coin-op'd Edison . . > All of those 'Dutch' references were common, long ago. They also mostly > meant Germans of any sort, not just people from Holland Hey I'm old but not that old. :-) I had not heard those particular references but I live in a southern Indiana river town of many German immigrants. A large creek divides the city east and west. The westsiders, myself included, have long been known as (ahem) 'thrifty". We were always called "westside Dutchman"....meaning a tightfisted German. Funny thing about westside people, they always bought the best and kept it forever. When they finished with it they stored it....carefully. I've seen many pristine phonographs, radios, antique cars, top end player pianos.....you name it. They wanted their money's worth, got it and then took care of whatever it was. Westside Dutchman....and proud of it ;-) Bruce > Eric, > > I am sorry, but I can not let your "Dutch" references go without > responding. > > I don't think that your "Dutch = inferior" comments were > pertainent or in good taste. I have not heard the > examples you quote in my little corner of the English-speaking > world, so it does give one hope that the phrases you quote are > more local than you realize. > > In any event, I do hope that we can have meaningful discourse > without racial characterizations such as you provided in your > posting. They do sound a little like fingernails on a blackboard to > some of us. > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 4 > Date: Mon, 04 Oct 2004 15:18:36 -0700 > From: Loran Hughes <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Racial Inferences (was Coin-op'd Edison . . > .) > To: Antique Phonograph List <[email protected]> > Message-ID: <1096928315.2538.78.ca...@oemcomputer> > Content-Type: text/plain > > On Mon, 2004-10-04 at 14:00, Robert Wright wrote: > > I'm not sure Eric meant to imply that Dutch folks are in any way inferior, > > though I can definitely see your point, Don. I have, however, heard some of > > those phrases in my part of the world. I wonder about the origin, as Dutch > > Auctions, as well as "going Dutch", are common phrases that mean "even" or > > "equal" in terms of value/cost. Hmm. > > > > Lest I dig my own grave, I'll only offer some insight as to the origin > of the terms, some of which likely date to the 1800's and early 1900's. > >From the 1913 Webster's Dictionary: > > http://www.webster-dictionary.org/definition/Dutch > > Jack London also wrote a short story entitled "Dutch Courage", which was > published in 1900: > > http://sunsite.berkeley.edu/London/Writings/DutchCourage/dutch.html > > Dutch metal is defined as a substitute for gold leaf and may still be > referred to as such: > > http://www.encyclopedia.com/html/b1/brass.asp > > For the record, I have more than a touch of Dutch in my family tree. and > most of those phrases were alien to me. > > Loran > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 5 > Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 18:21:57 -0400 > From: "Eric Stott" <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Racial Inferences (was Coin-op'd Edison . . > .) > To: "Antique Phonograph List" <[email protected]> > Message-ID: <003501c4aa60$8f6d8c00$43e6f...@s0027474218> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Well, I do apologize, but I do wonder that you've never heard them- those > references are neither local nor current. > > Eric Stott > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "DON MAYER" <[email protected]> > To: <[email protected]> > Sent: Monday, October 04, 2004 4:43 PM > Subject: [Phono-L] Racial Inferences (was Coin-op'd Edison . . .) > > > > Eric, > > > > I am sorry, but I can not let your "Dutch" references go without > > responding. > > > > I don't think that your "Dutch = inferior" comments were > > pertainent or in good taste. I have not heard the > > examples you quote in my little corner of the English-speaking > > world, so it does give one hope that the phrases you quote are > > more local than you realize. > > > > In any event, I do hope that we can have meaningful discourse > > without racial characterizations such as you provided in your > > posting. They do sound a little like fingernails on a blackboard to > > some of us. > > > > Respectfully, > > Don Mayer > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Phono-L mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://oldcrank.org/mailman/listinfo/phono-l > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 6 > Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 18:28:06 -0400 > From: "Eric Stott" <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Racial Inferences (was Coin-op'd Edison . . > .) > To: "Antique Phonograph List" <[email protected]> > Message-ID: <003d01c4aa61$6b822f20$43e6f...@s0027474218> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > "Dutch Auction" in the sense of a Reverse Auction, was explained to me in > this way, many years ago--- > "The auctioneer starts at a high price, then gradually lowers it until the > anxious buyer gasps out the highest figure he is willing to pay". > Also- the term "Dutch Metal" is still a common term for an imitation gold > leaf compound made of copper and zinc. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Robert Wright" <[email protected]> > To: "Antique Phonograph List" <[email protected]> > Sent: Monday, October 04, 2004 5:00 PM > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Racial Inferences (was Coin-op'd Edison . . .) > > > > I'm not sure Eric meant to imply that Dutch folks are in any way inferior, > > though I can definitely see your point, Don. I have, however, heard some > of > > those phrases in my part of the world. I wonder about the origin, as > Dutch > > Auctions, as well as "going Dutch", are common phrases that mean "even" or > > "equal" in terms of value/cost. Hmm. > > > > Best, > > Robert Wright > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 7 > Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 17:52:30 -0500 > From: "Robert Wright" <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Racial Inferences (was Coin-op'd Edison . . > .) > To: "Antique Phonograph List" <[email protected]> > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > Wow, I'll consider this e-mail the reference touchstone for this subject - > in fact, I'll consider it closed. Thanks for that insight, Dan, and for the > research, Loran! Intellect AND heart - that's why I love this list. > > R. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Dan Kjeldgaard" <[email protected]> > To: "Antique Phonograph List" <[email protected]> > Sent: Monday, October 04, 2004 5:15 PM > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Racial Inferences (was Coin-op'd Edison . . .) > > > > All of those 'Dutch' references were common, long ago. They also mostly > > meant Germans of any sort, not just people from Holland (Pennsylvania > Dutch > > = Germans, vaudeville's Dutch comedians = Germans) > > "Dutch Courage" is especially common; I'm surprised you haven't heard > that > > one. (Try Jack London's short story "Dutch Courage" , for the longest > > definition) . I don't like to see our colorful language throttled by > > Political Correctness > > > > > > > > ps - 100+ years ago, Germany was well known for producing CHEAP > manufactured > > goods - just look at all the "British" records stamped there, and the many > > cheap gramophones, too. Edison himself considered the Germans to be > > "cheese-parers" - and he was half 'Dutch' > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "DON MAYER" <[email protected]> > > To: <[email protected]> > > Sent: Monday, October 04, 2004 4:43 PM > > Subject: [Phono-L] Racial Inferences (was Coin-op'd Edison . . .) > > > > > > Eric, > > > > I am sorry, but I can not let your "Dutch" references go without > > responding. > > > > I don't think that your "Dutch = inferior" comments were > > pertainent or in good taste. I have not heard the > > examples you quote in my little corner of the English-speaking > > world, so it does give one hope that the phrases you quote are > > more local than you realize. > > > > In any event, I do hope that we can have meaningful discourse > > without racial characterizations such as you provided in your > > posting. They do sound a little like fingernails on a blackboard to > > some of us. > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Phono-L mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://oldcrank.org/mailman/listinfo/phono-l > > > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 8 > Date: Mon, 4 Oct 2004 22:31:28 -0700 (PDT) > From: Phillip Sands <[email protected]> > Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Racial Inferences (was Coin-op'd Edison . . > .) > To: Antique Phonograph List <[email protected]> > Message-ID: <[email protected]> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii > > I live in West Michigan, where there is the largest > population of Dutch people outside of Holland. We even > have a town on Lake Michigan named Holland. I grew up > with Holanders, they were prominent in my High School. > They are renowned for being cheapskates, for squeezing > a nickel till it screams for mercy. I have seen my > Hollander friends, when I was much younger, get into > fistfights over who was the bigger skinflint. Its a > long running joke in this area... > > > --- Loran Hughes <[email protected]> wrote: > > > On Mon, 2004-10-04 at 14:00, Robert Wright wrote: > > > I'm not sure Eric meant to imply that Dutch folks > > are in any way inferior, > > > though I can definitely see your point, Don. I > > have, however, heard some of > > > those phrases in my part of the world. I wonder > > about the origin, as Dutch > > > Auctions, as well as "going Dutch", are common > > phrases that mean "even" or > > > "equal" in terms of value/cost. Hmm. > > > > > > > Lest I dig my own grave, I'll only offer some > > insight as to the origin > > of the terms, some of which likely date to the > > 1800's and early 1900's. > > >From the 1913 Webster's Dictionary: > > > > http://www.webster-dictionary.org/definition/Dutch > > > > Jack London also wrote a short story entitled "Dutch > > Courage", which was > > published in 1900: > > > > > http://sunsite.berkeley.edu/London/Writings/DutchCourage/dutch.html > > > > Dutch metal is defined as a substitute for gold leaf > > and may still be > > referred to as such: > > > > http://www.encyclopedia.com/html/b1/brass.asp > > > > For the record, I have more than a touch of Dutch in > > my family tree. and > > most of those phrases were alien to me. > > > > Loran > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Phono-L mailing list > > [email protected] > > http://oldcrank.org/mailman/listinfo/phono-l > > > > > > > _______________________________ > Do you Yahoo!? > Declare Yourself - Register online to vote today! > http://vote.yahoo.com > > > ------------------------------ > > Message: 9 > Date: Tue, 5 Oct 2004 08:56:21 -0700 > From: "Mike Stitt" <[email protected]> > Subject: [Phono-L] Dutch > To: <[email protected]> > Message-ID: <004a01c4aaf3$ddc61e60$1b3e1...@mike> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" > > I have a tree in the front yard that suffers from Dutch elm disease!!! > You know, I suffer from amnesia and this is deja vu all over again....I think I have already forgotten this! > Mike > oldcranky > -------------- next part -------------- > An HTML attachment was scrubbed... > URL: http://www.intellitechcomputing.com/pipermail/phono-l/attachments/20041005/49963048/attachment-0001.html > > ------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > Phono-L mailing list > [email protected] > http://oldcrank.org/mailman/listinfo/phono-l > > > End of Phono-L Digest, Vol 1, Issue 31 > **************************************
