hi all good response jeff but bill kocher is from vernon connecticut and his cranks are great best to all zono From [email protected] Sat Jan 13 08:53:27 2007 From: [email protected] ([email protected]) Date: Sat Jan 13 08:53:47 2007 Subject: [Phono-L] Protective Coatings on Brass Horns In-Reply-To: <[email protected]> Message-ID: <[email protected]>
A century ago, brass horns were given a coat of lacquer to prevent them from tarnishing (lacquer has been around for centuries). This was brushed on, and when found today with original lacquer still intact, the brush strokes are often apparent. Like others who responded to this thread, I have never seen a century-old brass horn retaining its original lacquer and still shining like new. The lacquer wears with handling and cleaning over the years, and the brass begins to oxidize. 20 or 30 years ago, there was a collecting contingent who claimed that "patina" (tarnished original finishes) on brass phonograph horns should be preserved at all costs. This struck me at the time as tantamount to preserving rust -- and neither rust nor tarnish were original equipment on phonographs! I've been happy in observing that virtually all the advanced collections I've seen in the past decade have featured newly polished and lacquered brass horns, preserving them for another 100 years. George Paul ________________________________________________________________________ Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, free AOL Mail and more. From [email protected] Sat Jan 13 10:00:08 2007 From: [email protected] (George Glastris) Date: Sat Jan 13 10:00:13 2007 Subject: [Phono-L] Protective Coatings on Brass Horns References: <[email protected]> Message-ID: <172001c7373c$a9f2b710$8248a...@none05vofc1vwp> I feel I should add to George Paul's comments on lacquered brass. First of all I am not fully knowledgeable on types of lacquer used in horns. However, with other types of brass ware, namely scientific instruments (microscopes, telescopes, surveying instruments, et al) the lacquer used can and does often survive in excellent condition. Any cleaning/polishing of this finish can and often does lead to the loss of the original finish and can and does lower the value of the instrument, sometimes by more than half. A shiny new looking instrument compared to one that has a respectable, yet aged patina, is not only un-acceptable with collectors, but often shunned. I'd like to pass on a story that happened when I was the scientific and mechanical music specialist at Christie's in London. A couple brought in a very important early brass quadrant (17th century if my memory serves me right). They knew nothing about it, having found it in the attic of a deceased relatives home. We explained that it was not only valuable, but quite important historically, and that it would fetch 10s of thousands of pounds. They wanted to think about it over the weekend and left. Sure enough on Monday morning they returned wanting to consign it. But, thinking they knew best, they had gotten the brass cleaner out and polished the hell out of it, thus slashing the value down by many, many thousands. As George says, 20-30 years ago a tarnished horn was more accepted than a re-polished horn and that has now changed. However, who is to say in a few years it won't revert to the old way. Also, think about how "aged" looking it is. Is the brass as black as can be or is it just a slightly darkened brass? Patina is important to many collectors and once lost can not be replaced. Some phonograph horns do darken considerably due to the loss of the lacquer and especially due to the polishing off of the lacquer. The reason for the lacquer was not only protection of the metal itself but to keep from having to polish the brass. So, the point of my message is this: before polishing brass of any type decide for yourself if it really is too far gone or if you may not keep the machine the rest of your life. Best to all, George Glastris ----- Original Message ----- From: <[email protected]> To: <[email protected]> Sent: Saturday, January 13, 2007 10:53 AM Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Protective Coatings on Brass Horns > A century ago, brass horns were given a coat of lacquer to prevent them > from tarnishing (lacquer has been around for centuries). This was brushed > on, and when found today with original lacquer still intact, the brush > strokes are often apparent. Like others who responded to this thread, I > have never seen a century-old brass horn retaining its original lacquer > and still shining like new. The lacquer wears with handling and cleaning > over the years, and the brass begins to oxidize. > > 20 or 30 years ago, there was a collecting contingent who claimed that > "patina" (tarnished original finishes) on brass phonograph horns should be > preserved at all costs. This struck me at the time as tantamount to > preserving rust -- and neither rust nor tarnish were original equipment on > phonographs! I've been happy in observing that virtually all the advanced > collections I've seen in the past decade have featured newly polished and > lacquered brass horns, preserving them for another 100 years. > > George Paul > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > Check out the new AOL. Most comprehensive set of free safety and security > tools, free access to millions of high-quality videos from across the web, > free AOL Mail and more. > _______________________________________________ > Phono-L mailing list > http://phono-l.oldcrank.org > > > -- > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.1.410 / Virus Database: 268.16.10/624 - Release Date: 1/12/2007 > >
