Hi Bob
I can't remeber for sure what one of these little barrels look like exactly.
Based on your description tapping on the end of the shaft might pop the cover.
Another method I've used on similar situations is a heavy brass rod ground down
to a chisel edge. I place this at the edge of the cap and pound against the rod
with a hammer, moving around the perimeter till it comes loose.
Be careful if pounding directly on any shaft. Use only a plastic or soft faced
hammer so as not to damage the end of shaft. A block of hard wood or aluminum
will also work in a pinch.
Great Lakes Antique Phonographs
George Vollema
From: Bob
To: Antique Phonograph List
Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2009 2:21 PM
Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Repairing a fiber gear
Hi Rich,
I have good news and bad news. The good news is that I successfully
repaired the fiber gear. I cleaned it first with clock cleaning solution
and acetone. When I was sure all the old grease had been removed, I built
up the damaged teeth with JB Weld. This was a lot easier to do than I
thought. The material can be worked to almost the correct shape before it
sets up and then cleaned up with a Swiss pattern file after it hardens. I
had it almost perfect after one try and after the second application I had
the gear turning the worm in the governor perfectly. The bad news is that
when I took it apart after the first test there was a fair amount of tension
on the spring and it appears that I broke it when all the tension let go at
once.Does any one know how to take the spring barrel apart? There's a cap
on the end that extends down the side of the barrel about 3/8". I'm
assuming that if I have the gear with the spring arbor on it in the barrel I
can bang on the end with a hammer and force the cap off. Does this sound
correct? I don't want to mess it up again . If you know how to remove the
cap, please advise.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Rich" <[email protected]>
To: "Antique Phonograph List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Saturday, July 04, 2009 6:27 PM
Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Repairing a fiber gear
> Bob,
> I used to know what those were made out of but right now its a blank.
> The trick is to get the grease out of it so something will bond
> properly. Once its clean I think I would use a thinned epoxy as a paint
> to build it up and firm up what was left. Most products sold as epoxy
> are polyester and that will not work. The easiest place to find the
> real epoxy is a marina and acetone is the thinner for it. You can thin
> it down so it can be brushed on.
>
> Bob wrote:
>> Hi Rich,
>> Well I thought it was fixed by replacing the felt but not so. The
>> fiber gear is definitely stripped. I can still see the gear teeth so
>> that if I can build it up with something I can file out the excess an
>> hopefully have a useable gear. The question is what to use to build it
>> up. I guess the first thing to do is clean off the gear completely so
>> that whatever I use will stick. I assume I can remove all the grease
>> with something like acetone. Do you know what the fiber gear is made
>> from? This would help in deciding what to use. Two possible materials
>> come to mind. The first is Weldwood wood filler. It looks a lot like
>> the firer gear and could be worked easily with a small Swiss pattern
>> file after it set up. I'm not sure if it will stick to the firer gear
>> material or is strong enough to form the replacement teeth. The second
>> possibility is a clear epoxy. The advantage to this is that the pattern
>> of the original teeth will be visible through it and it will be easier
>> to see how the teeth should be filed. Do you have any suggestions?
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rich" <[email protected]>
>> To: "Antique Phonograph List" <[email protected]>
>> Sent: Monday, June 22, 2009 7:32 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Repairing a fiber gear
>>
>>
>>> If you plan on using the machine a lot it will still help to change it
>>> out. Once the felt gets oil soaked and the old oil oxidizes its pretty
>>> much done.
>>>
>>> Good to hear that it worked out well!
>>>
>>> Rich
>>>
>>> Bob wrote:
>>>> Hi Rich,
>>>> Well you were right, the felt was the problem. It was quite
>>>> distorted and hanging over the edge of the brass disk on the governor.
>>>> . As the rest of the felt looked pretty good, I only had to reposition
>>>> it in the arm that holds it and cut off the excess and reform the front
>>>> so that it was parallel with the governor disk. Thanks for your help.
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rich" <[email protected]>
>>>> To: "Antique Phonograph List" <[email protected]>
>>>> Sent: Sunday, June 21, 2009 3:19 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Repairing a fiber gear
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Try and change the felt without spreading the bent metal that holds
>>>>> it.
>>>>> Usually you can cut a piece of real wool felt a bit tapered and pull
>>>>> it into the clamp without bending them as they tend to break. Use
>>>>> real
>>>>> 100% wool felt or it will fail.
>>>>>
>>>>> Bob wrote:
>>>>>> Hi Rich,
>>>>>> The governor felt is pretty much as you described. I will change
>>>>>> that first. If it's that easy I owe this list a Big Thank you.
>>>>>> Bob
>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Rich" <[email protected]>
>>>>>> To: "Antique Phonograph List" <[email protected]>
>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, June 21, 2009 12:32 PM
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Phono-L] Repairing a fiber gear
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Most of the older fiber gears are destroyed by petroleum. Clean
>>>>>>> it off
>>>>>>> and look at it real hard. Sanding is not going to fix it. look
>>>>>>> at the
>>>>>>> felt pad that the governor runs against if its oil soaked and mushed
>>>>>>> out
>>>>>>> the governor will flutter. Replace the felt. Use real felt and not
>>>>>>> cheap polyester. F-1 or F-2 grade felt works. The felt is easy,
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> gear not so.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Bob wrote:
>>>>>>>> I'm restoring a Thorens Excelda. I've got it running pretty well
>>>>>>>> but
>>>>>>>> am having a severe problem with wow and flutter. It's so bad
>>>>>>>> that it
>>>>>>>> makes listening almost impossible. The records appear to be
>>>>>>>> traveling at a consistent speed but there must be minute
>>>>>>>> hesitations
>>>>>>>> that are impossible to see but they surely affect the sound
>>>>>>>> quality.
>>>>>>>> The mainspring is plenty strong so that's not the problem and the
>>>>>>>> reproducer sounds fantastic on other machines. The problem appears
>>>>>>>> to be caused by excessive wear on the fiber gear that mates with
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> worm gear in the governor. A friend suggested I clean it and try
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> build up the bad areas with JB Weld. I'm afraid to do this
>>>>>>>> because I
>>>>>>>> think it will be very difficult to control and be irreversible if I
>>>>>>>> do it wrong. I've been thinking about cleaning all the grease
>>>>>>>> off of
>>>>>>>> it and checking over for defects with a magnifier. If I can see
>>>>>>>> areas in the gear thread that are raised I will smooth them out
>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>> sand paper. To try to build up an
>>>>>>> y areas that look low I will paint on some lacquer or urethane
>>>>>>> varnish. As I mentioned earlier, the turntable appears to be
>>>>>>> rotating
>>>>>>> at a consistent speed so It shouldn't take much to true up the teeth
>>>>>>> enough to work properly. I'm looking for second opinions on this
>>>>>>> technique or any other technique that you think will solve the
>>>>>>> problem. Thanks
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> Phono-L mailing list
>>>>>>>> http://phono-l.oldcrank.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Phono-L mailing list
>>>>>>> http://phono-l.oldcrank.org
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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