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I've just started using the SOAP classes define a web service and have gotten a lot done, but am having some strange and peculiar errors. I started by using this tutorial: http://www.phppatterns.com/index.php/article/articleview/41/1/2/ which works fine by itself. Then I tried to return a SOAP_Fault and I started getting "0 bytes returned from server" type messages. Usually from curl_exec. I eventually traced the problem to Base::_serializeValue. This function was getting called recursively with the same values. After hours of debugging, I finally found that if I removed the $soapServer variable from the server class and moved the server logic out of the class (as in the actual SOAP examples) this problem went away. Seems like a very strange thing to fix it, but it worked. Now, I'm having the same kind of problem, but I can't find a cause. I'm using a home-grown DB abstraction class (yes, I know I should switch to PEAR::DB) and whenever a connection to Oracle fails (wrong DB name, for instance), the Base::_serializeValue function gets called recursively sometime after I return a value from my server function. If I put a die('died here') before the return, all works as expected, including creation of the SOAP_Fault. After the return, the recursion causes Apache to segfault. There are no internal soap variables within this class and I have even tried unsetting the variable which holds the DB class. I've tried switching to PEAR DB with no luck. I just tried only connecting to the oracle database with OCILogon and the same thing happens. Looks like this may be an actual PHP problem... Justin Patrin Junior Developer PNI Corporation (707)566-2260 ext, 318 (707)566-4318 Fax