While I don't necessarily agree with the law, I think it may be blown out of 
proportion. What it's actually restricting is the quiescent current (the amount 
of power a circuit/device uses when effectively turned off) of a device, not 
the full-load power, and the allowable amount actually increases as more 
powerful components are added.

Jays Two Cents explains it pretty effectively: 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N5fc5ZX6Kzk

On Wed, Jul 28, 2021, at 3:01 AM, Matthew Gibson via PLUG-discuss wrote:
> greg zegan via PLUG-discuss said on Tue, 27 Jul 2021 14:16:27 +0000
> (UTC)
> 
> >https://www.zerohedge.com/political/59-million-americans-prohibited-buying-high-end-dell-gaming-pcs
> >
> 
> Allow me to change the headline of this article to...
> 
> "Six States Responsible Enough to Limit Computer Power Consumption"
> 
> Anyone prioritizing their video game performance over the starvation,
> water wars, crop failures, climate refugees, underwater cities, deserts
> replacing farmland, and normalization of cat 5 hurricanes that will
> surely come if we don't handle this situation correctly, is an ethical
> cripple.
> 
> And anyone, who just has to have that superburner computer, of an age
> not likely to live until 2060 is just borrowing on a future they know
> they won't repay.
> 
> And it's not like you can't wait 4 years and have a computer using a
> couple hundred wats that performs like today's 1000 watt gargantuan.
> 
> SteveT
> 
> Steve Litt
> Spring 2021 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful
> Technologist http://www.troubleshooters.com/techniques
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mmmmmm No, I reject your attempt at gas-lighting the discussion away from 
> liberty infringing regulations. I reject your blithe attempt to validate 
> power hungry government attempts to slowly curtail the freedoms of Americans.
> 
> All of those crises can and will be addressed by private industry and not by 
> some pencil pushing bureaucratic cubicle rat. The Federal Government (one 
> could also include state governments) will never ever be able to address 
> problems faster than private industry will be able to. Look into FEMA’s 
> response to hurricane Katrina back in the late 2000’s as a prime example. 
> Look into that same organizations response to Puerto Rico and their recent 
> natural disaster.
> 
> The climate changes. Humans need to adapt. To think that we can hold back 
> change of this magnitude is hubris. We need to take better care of our 
> things. Yes. But we also need to take care of ourselves while we do that. You 
> think a family in India, or Africa is going to give a hoot about a 2 degree C 
> increase in global temperatures over the next 100 years? I suggest you 
> rethink that methodology if you do. Those families are only concerned about 
> where their next meal will come from.
> 
> Anyone who wants a superburner computer and has the capital to spend on it 
> should be able to purchase it, and then also worry about how they will power 
> it. It is unethical to restrict another human’s right to their pursuit of 
> happiness so long as that pursuit doesn’t directly infringe on another’s 
> right to life, liberty, and their own pursuit of happiness.
> 
> I think it’s an amazing thing that technology makes such marvelous advances 
> in such a short time. Not a reason to limit someone else’s liberty at this 
> date.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Aaron Jones via PLUG-discuss said on Tue, 27 Jul 2021 15:04:58 -0700
> 
> >Those are some dangerous statements.
> 
> Dangerous statements? What, are my statements going to insurance rates
> going up?
> 
> https://www.popularmechanics.com/science/environment/a27180829/global-warming-is-already-costing-the-insurance-industry-historic-amounts/
> 
> Insurance rates? Why is that even being brought up? It’s a problem for the 
> insurer and the insuree to discuss. If the insurer doesn’t like the risk of 
> insuring someone’s hair brained idea to build on the coast as the coast 
> recedes….. sounds like a problem for the person with the hair brained idea to 
> build where climate change is going to destroy their hair brained idea. Only 
> dangerous to that person…
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Perhaps my statements could cause an increase in annual hurricane
> energy:
> 
> https://weather.com/storms/hurricane/news/2020-11-18-top-10-most-extreme-hurricane-seasons-2020
> 
> Oh, I know. My statements are dangerous because they caused 20 years of
> drought to the farmers in Western Colorado:
> 
> https://www.cpr.org/2021/07/23/western-slope-drought-cattle-ranching/
> 
> It must be nice to be able to wave your hand and claim adverse weather as 
> proof to support your theories of what is dangerous. Here’s a theory you can 
> prove: living is dangerous and fraught with risk at all points of life. 
> 
> I wasn't discussing China, but since you brought it up: Why in the
> WORLD should China go through the inconvenience of reducing carbon
> emissions and all forms of pollution if the US doesn't reduce energy
> use everywhere it can: Cars, airplanes, trucks, busses, lightbulbs, and
> yes, computers?
> 
> Why should China reduce their carbon footprint? Maybe because they are the 
> worst offender of greenhouse gas emissions? Maybe because Their reduction of 
> emissions will actually do more for your cause than severely hampering 
> America’s economy will? How many days did they need to shut down their 
> industry leading up to the 2008 Olympics for clear skies?
> 
> List of countries by greenhouse gas emissions - Wikipedia 
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_greenhouse_gas_emissions>
> 
> if you don’t like Wikipedia, maybe this site? Greenhouse Gas Emissions By 
> Country 2021 (worldpopulationreview.com) 
> <https://worldpopulationreview.com/country-rankings/greenhouse-gas-emissions-by-country>
> 
> of course, you should probably take most of these reports with a grain of 
> salt. Who knows if they are valid and genuine? *Shrug*
> 
> 
> Now I'll admit that those Dell Alienware computers, which from their
> components sound like they're about 500 watts at full use, don't sound
> excessive. And 20mpg highway didn't sound excessive in 2000 either, but
> now it does, because these laws and regulations forced car
> manufacturers to increase their gas efficiency, and now breathing in LA
> is a lot easier, and we're not as close to the tipping point as we
> otherwise would have been.
> 
> > But if you are war
> >hawking here and trying to bait us into a pollution debate so you can
> >get everyone to do the whole “war with China thing…” then you got my
> >reply and I admit I got baited.
> 
> Whoaaa, war with China? Huh? Where'd THAT come from?
> 
> 
> 
> War with China… came from a place more realistic than pointing to increased 
> Hurricane seasons and Rainfall in Colorado… The only way China is going to 
> curtail their economic development is by direct global action in the form of 
> military might.
> 
> 
> 
> Meanwhile, I'd be interested in hearing your age. I'm 71, so I don't
> have a dog in this fight: I'll be safely in my grave before this thing
> is more than an expense (hurricane insurance and repairs, higher food
> prices) and an annoyance, but my kids will be around long enough that,
> if we play this wrong, they'll be impacted by climate refugees, water
> wars, famine-causing drought, the whole bag of horrors. That's why I
> don't get indignant when they tell me how much power to use.
> 
> 
> 
> Ooooo look! An appeal to experience. Aside from an attempt to browbeat us 
> young whipper-snappers into silence… Why is your age even a discussion point?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Eric Oyen via PLUG-discuss said on Tue, 27 Jul 2021 21:22:33 -0700
> 
> >It is also interesting that those very same states that push EV’s also
> >have not upgraded their power systems in quite some time. California
> >is the leader on this list of shame with rolling blackouts and
> >brownouts each summer.
> 
> I think this is unfair to California. Much of California is the hottest
> in the US. Greenhouse gasses are created by everyone, but California
> can least afford to gain a degree. California is also the most
> populous state in the nation. So in spite of EV's and all their other
> moves to limit environmental damage, they can't reduce the heat that
> radiates or blows into California, so they can't keep all their
> citizens' houses below 85 Fahrenheit. Hence the rolling blackouts.
> 
> 
> 
> No. Not unfair to California, their power grid is their responsibility to 
> maintain. If they fail to plan for the future and prepare for dry seasons and 
> update their infrastructure, their rolling brownouts are on them. No where 
> else has had this problem even though California is not the only one affected 
> by increased temperatures. California needs to take better care of their 
> things. Plain and simple.
> 
> > They also want to put up more windmills, off
> >shore! Talk about throwing good money after bad and causing those of
> >us with computers that are capable of running linux no end of trouble.
> 
> I'm not sure how windmills cause havoc with Linux. I thought that was
> done by Microsoft.
> 
> California could sure use more fission reactors, but in a place where
> 7+ earthquakes are frequent, doing so is just too likely to cause
> another Chernobyl. Plus, anything near the coast is likely to go
> Fukushima with a tsunami. They don't have a river capable of generating
> huge power from its current. They can't import from surrounding states,
> and back in the day, when they imported from Texas, the Texan power
> companies stiffed California's power grid in order to make a bigger
> profit.
> 
> So, other than solar, wind and conservation, I don't see what other
> options California has.
> 
> 
> 
> First. Chernobyl cannot happen in the West because we never built RBMK 
> reactors with a positive void co-efficient. We place reactors inside 
> containment vessels to help curtail fallout in the event of a disaster. 
> Attempt to invoke Chernobyl disaster as anti-nuclear argument denied. 
> Fukushima is more relevant because of California’s relative location and 
> geographical environment. That said. Nuclear plants have only continued to 
> become safer and more efficient. Safer and more efficient than coal, gas, and 
> maybe even “renewable sources” Nuclear should be more seriously discussed as 
> a viable alternative power source.
> 
> 
> 
> It leaves us with 60 million people who can't game quite as hard. Boo
> hoo hoo.
> 
> 
> 
> It leaves us with our liberty just slightly more chipped away at. It leaves 
> us with a government emboldened to infringe on rights just ever so more. 
> 
> What's this fascination with China that you all have? China uses the
> energy equivalent of 27,018 million barrels of oil for 1394 million
> people, equalling 19.4 barrels per person. The US uses the equivalent of
> 18,684 million barrels and has 328 million people, equaling 56.9
> barrels per person.
> 
> See above discussion on China’s CO2 production. Oil is only a part of that 
> carbon footprint. Go do more research.
> 
> 
> So here's the question: If some country using almost triple the energy
> per person than your country says *you* are the problem and should cut,
> and they won't do squat until you cut, what would you say to them?
> 
> 
> 
> Question invalid. Communist Dictatorships don’t give a hoot what outsiders 
> say. Unless that speech is in the form of military might bearing down on said 
> dictatorship. 
> 
> You ask where it leaves us. Hey, if you're 60 years old, it leaves you
> having lived a pretty fun life. If you're 20 years old, it leaves you
> with a very hard (and probably considerably foreshortened) second half
> of your life. If you were just born today, by the time you graduate
> college, the world will be rife with climate refugees and water wars,
> and by the time you're 50, if you last that long, the population
> decline will be brutal and pretty universal except for the very rich.
> All because everybody in 2021 said the other guy should cut his
> emissions first.
> 
> Life is hard. Always will be. There will always be something new to be a risk.
> 
> 
> One more thing: Some friends of mine ran the numbers and according to
> them the California computer energy standards aren't as strict as those
> of the EU.
> 
> I feel not a bit of sorrow for the 60 million potential gamers who play
> at a slight disadvantage, if they play at all. I feel sorry for their
> grandchildren.
> 
> 
> 
> Your feigned sympathy just undermines your attempts at argument for your 
> cause of infringing on liberty. 
> 
> 
> 
> Final Analysis, You must hate the freedom Linux provides to its users and the 
> liberty with which we may embark upon through its use.
> 
> 
> 
> Olive Branch: If you would like to meet up at a park where we can social 
> distance and have a veggie burger while I grill up some brats, I'd be willing 
> to bring the makings for a BBQ and we can discuss these details in a more 
> civil manner than Keyboard Warriors. 
> 
> 
> 
> Matt
> 
> 
> On Wed, Jul 28, 2021 at 1:13 AM Steve Litt via PLUG-discuss 
> <[email protected]> wrote:
>> Eric Oyen via PLUG-discuss said on Tue, 27 Jul 2021 22:53:09 -0700
>> 
>> >So, guys, nice little debate we all got snagged into here because of
>> >some state regulations that would prevent nearly 60 million people
>> >from owning technologies that would make their lives more convenient.
>> >Regulations put in place by politicians who know nothing of real
>> >science and are trying to kiss up to china. Now, where does that leave
>> >us?
>> 
>> It leaves us with 60 million people who can't game quite as hard. Boo
>> hoo hoo. 
>> 
>> What's this fascination with China that you all have? China uses the
>> energy equivalent of 27,018 million barrels of oil for 1394 million
>> people, equalling 19.4 barrels per person. The US uses the equivalent of
>> 18,684 million barrels and has 328 million people, equaling 56.9
>> barrels per person.
>> 
>> So here's the question: If some country using almost triple the energy
>> per person than your country says *you* are the problem and should cut,
>> and they won't do squat until you cut, what would you say to them? 
>> 
>> You ask where it leaves us. Hey, if you're 60 years old, it leaves you
>> having lived a pretty fun life. If you're 20 years old, it leaves you
>> with a very hard (and probably considerably foreshortened) second half
>> of your life. If you were just born today, by the time you graduate
>> college, the world will be rife with climate refugees and water wars,
>> and by the time you're 50, if you last that long, the population
>> decline will be brutal and pretty universal except for the very rich.
>> All because everybody in 2021 said the other guy should cut his
>> emissions first.
>> 
>> One more thing: Some friends of mine ran the numbers and according to
>> them the California computer energy standards aren't as strict as those
>> of the EU.
>> 
>> I feel not a bit of sorrow for the 60 million potential gamers who play
>> at a slight disadvantage, if they play at all. I feel sorry for their
>> grandchildren.
>> 
>> SteveT
>> 
>> Steve Litt 
>> Spring 2021 featured book: Troubleshooting Techniques of the Successful
>> Technologist http://www.troubleshooters.com/techniques
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