On Wed, 25 Jan 2006 15:23:43 -0700, "Bryan Sant" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said: > On 1/25/06, Roberto Mello <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Yikes. Can't I just mod this as troll and move on?
Oh, crap. Somebody pushed Bryan's "Rabid java defense" button. > > - Developer performance goes (way) up > > This is only true if you're restricted to use vim or emacs. [...] > If you use an IDE such as Eclipse or NetBeans, your > productivity with Java and these tools far outstrips that of dynamic > languages. Have you actually used a modern dynamic language like Python for more than a couple days? Have you used it with a similarly modern IDE, like Wing or Komodo? I come from the Java camp. I've presented at the Utah Java UG, twice. I'm no novice. But I started doing Python full-time about a year ago and I feel _hugely_ more productive. It frustrates me: there's this growing camp of people saying, "We've been there! We know Java! But we recognize a better thing when we see it!" but [some] Java people stick their heads in the sand and say, "I do not like green eggs and ham! I do not like them, Sam I Am!" And to a point it's understandable when you've invested all this time and effort in a system, to not want to start over in a new one. But it's still disappointing to see. > So long as it is small enough for a single person or small group to > maintain. For larger projects, type-safety and mature frameworks save > time and reduce errors. I used to think this, too. Now, I'm not so sure. But, since I'm going to do my best to never work for a large company again, I don't really care too much. The amount of functionality a small group can achieve in Python is staggering. The vast majority of projects won't _need_ more than a handful of developers, with the acompanying exponential increase in time lost to communication impedance. > > - Need for consultants goes down > > If your staff isn't skilled enough to work with Java, then I'm sure > this is true. Oh, come on. Let's be honest here. Look at poor Ryan over there -- he's barely sure what J2EE _is_, let alone whether his project needs it. With very few exceptions (*cough* twisted *cough*) you don't see this kind of bloated monstrosity in the Python world. Now, here we're conflating Java-the-language with Java-the-set-of- standards. But you don't see one without the other very often, and that's where the consultants suck the blood out of the industry. -Jonathan -- C++ is history repeated as tragedy. Java is history repeated as farce. --Scott McKay /* PLUG: http://plug.org, #utah on irc.freenode.net Unsubscribe: http://plug.org/mailman/options/plug Don't fear the penguin. */
