Thus said Stuart Jansen on Thu, 26 Jun 2008 06:34:20 MDT: > On Wed, 2008-06-25 at 21:51 -0600, Andy Bradford wrote: > They are not > an option because even some low-income people want a home. > > I think you meant house. A house is not a home. An apartment, > townhouse or even an RV can be a home.
Yes, thank you for the correction. I did mean house. > Never heard of democracy? Huh, that's too bad 'cause it's been working > pretty well for us for a couple hundred years. If democracy is so grand, why don't we go full out and practice a true democracy (which America is not)? Last I checked, the Constitution established a republican form of government. This is not one in which majority rules, which is really just a glorified form of mob rules. This is one in which we seek to establish just laws; although lately, as in the last century or so, we seem to have lost sight of that principle. Would you advocate true democracy? > Never heard of trial and error, the scientific method, wisdom from > experience, or even common sense? Yes, trial and error is fine where all interactions are voluntary. This is what happens in a society in which all interactions are voluntary and government is restricted to protecting people and property. Innovations in laws are not fine. I'm sorry, but I will never accept being a guinea pig for law makers; my liberty and freedom, even life are much more important than that. Of course most feel its alright to use government to force others to do what they think is the ideal, simply because they are the ``majority.'' > A hundred years ago we didn't know that creating high-density > low-income housing like the projects was a bad idea, now based on > experience we do. According to who? So we have a few people here that think high-density, low-income housing developments are distasteful. As long as these developments arise out of voluntary exchange and interaction, what exactly is wrong with it? If it doesn't work out, we'll people will lose their interest, money, etc... and eventually we'll have either a ghost town or it will be sold off for more efficient uses. What exactly can government contribute to this process? And if its ``planning'' who are they and how did they get so wise? Is there anything worse in housing than government subsidized housing projects? Maybe this is where the phrase, ``piece of HUD'' arose? > A pure free market does not magically converge instantly to > perfection, it takes time and along the way there are bumps. > Government should be given the same opportunity. There's a big difference between voluntary interaction and government. One involves peaceful interactions, the other involves force, even deadly force. This kind of power only should be used when there is aggression against someone's person or property. It shouldn't be used when someone decides they want a smaller/larger house on less than desirable lot sizes. > You'll need more tools. This is the eternal cycle and end of bad government. Replace one bad tool with more bad tools. Haven't you ever wondered why bad regulations require yet more bad regulations to fix them? And the cycle never ends. Eventually things fall apart (Rome anyone?) and the whole process starts over. Speaking of tools, I found the following books very enlightening: http://users.aol.com/xeqtr1/voluntaryist/nomahg.html http://www.constitution.org/law/bastiat.htm The first speaks of the tool called government. The second is a much more well known book by Frederic Bastiat. Both are short and easy to read. > Government is a tool to make capitalism possible and limit the damage > when it goes wrong. So basically government created laws so capitalism could exist? Or maybe people, desiring to protect their person and property invented government? And then capitalism naturally arose? The history of mankind is a history of man struggling to live free from coercion and aggression and to keep what is justly acquired. Again I ask, what is the proper role of government? Andy -- [-----------[system uptime]--------------------------------------------] 9:42pm up 43 min, 1 user, load average: 1.26, 1.17, 1.07 /* PLUG: http://plug.org, #utah on irc.freenode.net Unsubscribe: http://plug.org/mailman/options/plug Don't fear the penguin. */
