On 4/30/07, Ben Wilson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On 4/30/07, The Editor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > [...] > > > > Actually Kathryn, that is not completely fair. : ). First, there > > were several reasons--the biggest is suggested in the link I mentioned > > above at zapsite. Second, I have actually had as much or more > > positive feedback on the name change than negative, with several > > encouraging me NOT to change it back. Actually my associate is > > encouraging me to rename Hg to AcmeHg and MarkupExpressionsExtensions > > to AcmeExtensions, etc., and I must admit I find the idea kind of > > unifying. : ) > [...] > > > > Well, my associate has taken over maintenance of Hg, as noted on the > > page. And as it's only had one bug fix in recent memory (that others > > discovered, solved, and fixed) it's not a lot of work anyway. > > In the interest of full disclosure, I looked at your 'associate,' Wile > E. Coyote. This is the fellow who you say encourages keeping the Acme > moniker, and who you say has taken over Hg maintenance. However, his > profile redirects to PmWiki:Profiles.Caveman. Caveman is your handle, > unless my email archive is totally mistaken.
Clever detective work, my friend! : ) > I would like to discourage your continued use of references to a > certain popular cartoon series. Assume you become successful with your > wiki clone, you will undoubtedly incur the wrath of the holder of the > trademarked names and copyrights of the images you display. No worries... ZAPwiki will not include any reference to anything trademarked. It's also not a clone--as the entire codebase is redesigned from the ground up. There are some similar concepts but codewise it is virtually all new. Also, I am not too concerned about its success. I'm not even sure if I'll end up using it on my site (I'm leaning toward PmWiki). I just kept coming up against obstacles and complexities in PmWiki in regards to various cutting edge ZAP functionalities. ZAP works in PmWiki, and PmWiki is a great tool--but both could be integrated in ways that would make a lot of things cleaner and simpler. Also, there are several innovative features already in ZAPwiki that cannot be readily reproduced in PmWiki apart from a slew of add on recipes. Some simply cannot be done in PmWiki as is. But that's another topic. > As for "unifying" by naming a set of recipes maintained by you, I > would also discourage that. I presently maintain several recipes, but > you wouldn't tell by the recipe names. This sounds more like you're > carving out a fief than contributing to the growth and prosperity of > the PmWiki Community. Even if you are not, the impression is conveyed. > What happens if you reach a point, as Hans recently has, of where > you're not able to fully support your recipes and decide the community > is better served by allowing others to carry the load a while? This > community has flourished due to selfless, cooperative support. Perhaps you are right. On the other hand, some might see Acme as a useful warning indicator: a flashing red light--steer away from this code! beta! ameteur! If so, it might help to minimize the level of support needed to maintain the recipes. : ) Of course, there's no question that the success of the PmWiki community is its member's selfless, cooperative support of one another. FWIW, my contributions are offered along these lines. > ZAP sounds like a fork of PmWiki, judging from the approach taken by > the site. While GPL allows for code forks, it's generally done when > there is dissent in the developer community, or when the owner of the > code fails to support the community. Pm has put years of work into > making PmWiki the flexible, powerful tool it is; and he proves his > support to his user base by his daily involvement in the list. The reason for ZAPwiki is not dissent on my part, and certainly not a lack of support on Pm's part. He has my fullest gratitude and respect. And while not so much a fork as a brand new wiki, the reason for it's existense is simply I often find PmWiki too complex for most simple tasks and it's codebase too dense for me to understand. ZAP was created for the purpose of giving non-programmers easy access to powerful commands in PmWiki. ZAPwiki is just an extension of that goal--providing non-programmers even easier and simpler access to those same capabilities. All the professionals here at PmWiki I'm sure will continue to use it for it's robustness, security, and flexibility. I want to take a stab at developing something easier--just to see if I can do it. > I have to say I'm with Kathryn on this issue. Pmwiki thrives on an > open, cooperative environment. I recently applauded Pm for having > fostered an open-source community that embodies those characteristics > of a good community. Forking and fiefing are contra-productive in this > environment. Pm has indeed done a wonderful job! I certainly have no intention of forking or fiefing. I have only referred to ZAPwiki in response to others--and prefer to discuss it offlist. And Acme is hardly a fief--just a label indicating the recipes are connected in some way. Thanks for the input Ben... I've enjoyed learning about the ethics of open source communities almost as much as the coding. A curious but interesting environment. Cheers, Dan _______________________________________________ pmwiki-users mailing list [email protected] http://www.pmichaud.com/mailman/listinfo/pmwiki-users
