>[AL]
>There have also been a couple of messages offering to help get things
>going in NSW and we had lots of contacts from there in 1996.
>
>Perhaps it's time to get down to tin tacks for at least a NSW branch to
>startup immediately in response to whatever happens there while we are
>figuring out what else to do nationally?
I'm interested in working with others in NSW for a branch.
[AL]
My suggestion is that you and the other(s) that have already expressed
interest in
this proceed as follows:
1) Start a subject thread on "NSW" in this public-list specifically to
invite people
interested in helping to organize in NSW (this may turn out to involve
agreement
on a single NSW branch or on separate local groups in Sydney or parts of
Sydney and
other areas, or both - should not be prejudged). (This can easily be
moved to separate
list when necessary but meanwhile would be better here to encourage
others to setup
local groups too and ensure national liasion in the absence of a
functioning national
organization at the moment).
2) Agree among yourselves on somebody(s) to be in charge of a NSW
section of the
Neither web site which would have a URL of
http://www.neither.org/local/NSW/
(which could be the subject header for your thread even though it
doesn't exist
yet, so that people joining the public-list will immediately know where
to look
for more info when they see messages on that subject without having
followed the
thread from the beginning). If there is any delay on that, start by
opening your
own personal page(s) devoted to this and reach agreement on a common one
with
an official link as /local/NSW/ later. I believe this is very important
so that
there is something more "definate" about the people organizing Neither
in NSW
than individual email messages.
3) Expect a short delay while arrangements are made at this end for you
to be able
to independently edit that section (and for a prominent link to it to be
made from
the main Neither pages). But don't wait, start preparing documents to
put there in
the meantime - and if the delay isn't short enough, start it up on
somebody's personal
web site in the meantime - it can be easily moved later).
4) Agree among yourselves on somebody(s) to co-ordinate an initial open
meeting
of local Neither supporters and aim to call such a meeting and proceed
from there
as soon as you are confident of having say a dozen supporters turn up
and say 3-4
core activists willing to make organizing Neither in NSW a major
priority and accept
responsibility for taking on various tasks. Exchange phone numbers and
snail mail
addresses with the agreed on coordinator(s) for further coordination off
the list as well.
5) The co-ordinators agreed on should give high priority to extracting a
NSW section
of the Neither snail mailing list, email list and phone number lists
from the central
group. This should be a major help in reaching the targets I suggest in
item 4 for
convening an initial meeting. There would probably be a couple of
hundred people
from NSW who got in touch since 1996 and at least a dozen who offered to
help or took
some local initiative of their own during the 1996 campaign who should
be followed up
by both mailout and telephone tree.
6) Also follow up your own contacts (not just the coordinators' contacts
but those of
everyone who expresses an interest in organizing in NSW) to get others
to join this list
and to come to the initial meeting. Collect lists of other NSW
organizations and publications etc that you should get in touch with.
7) Take an activive interest in working out an appropriate national
structure for Neither
so that we really become one national organization rather than just
separate local groups
working independently and/or at cross purposes.
8) Take an active interest in how to make national policy that will be
followed by
local groups - as you are already doing with respect to compulsory or
optional
preferential voting discussed below - every issue Neither is involved in
as such
really is primarily national and questions like the NSW
optional/compulsory voting system
should be viewed as a local implementation of a national policy. e.g. If
you are right
that we should have a policy in favor of optional preferential voting in
NSW then we should
have the same policy in Victoria and elsewhere.
9) If you disagree with points 1-8 I still think you should start with
point 1 and
discuss an alternative approach in that subject thread - i.e. it isn't
necessary
to reach agreement with people outside NSW on how to go about starting
up a NSW
branch and/or NSW local groups - it will only be necessary to reach
wider agreement
on items 7 and 8 as to how various local groups come to be recognized as
"official"
local organizations of "Neither" as a national organization, which
depends on agreeing
on a framework for a national organization. Efforts on getting NSW
people together
will not be wasted whatever the outcome nationally, since if we fail to
work out a viable
national structure you would still be able to operate in parallel in NSW
under some
other name. i.e. Respond to this part of this message in a separate
"NSW" or
http://www.neither.org/local/NSW/ thread depending on whether you agree
or disagree
with the importance I attach to point 2.
10) Don't get frustrated about the inevitable startup delays. Things
will improve
when the 1996 contacts are available but even then it will be a long
haul. The key
thing is having a core of people who have made an assessment that this
is worth doing
and can eventually succeed.
[AL]
>Neither has no policy for either compulsory ("full") or optional
>preferential voting.
>(I prefer compulsory myself).
How can I then suggest that Neither make such a policy against
compulsory
allocation of preferences?
My suggestion is:
1. Start a thread on "Compulsory Preferential voting", state a clear
proposal
for Neither policy there (e.g. a) That Neither adopt national policy in
favor optional
preferential voting for both single member and multi-member electorates.
b) That support
for this policy be a requirement for membership. or c) That support for
this policy
not be a requirement for membership but be reflected in all official
statements on behalf
of Neither from both central and local groups).
2. Argue for that policy and seriously answer objections to it in that
thread.
3. Expect a vigorous and possibly protracted debate that will enable the
ultimate
formulation of a formal resolution and official "Yes" and "No" positions
for a formal vote when we actually have a sufficiently defined
membership and organizational structure
to be able to take such a vote. (Assuming that no "consensus" is reached
through discussion.)
4. Don't try to rush such a vote but work actively in other threads on
the general
issue of establishing an organizational structure capable of taking such
decisions
regularly, independently of any perceived urgency about resolving that
particular issue for the purposes of an immediate NSW campaign.
(If this is unduly prolonged there will be nothing to prevent you
working with those
who agree with you in NSW on this in a separate "Save Optional
Preferential Voting"
campaign in the meantime - since Neither does not have a policy against
optional
preferential voting either).
5. Welcome the debate rather than regretting the inconvenience of not
being able to
immediately act on what may appear to you to be obviously necessary
policy implications
from whatever is the basis on which Neither supporters are getting
organized. If you are
right, having to debate it internally will only strengthen your ability
to convince others
when you actually campaign for it. If you lose the debate internally
that may save you
from embarassment in an unsuccessful campaign.
[AA]
>Can anyone provide more info on either of these NSW issues?
I didn't know that they were reducing the size... I hadn't heard
anything
about it.
[AL]
This is one of the things the coordinators of any group taking on a
campaign
against changes to the electoral system in NSW will have to address. At
least
one of you will have to take responsibility for finding out such matters
and
finding out the details of the history and current state of the NSW
electoral
system and proposals for changing it, including monitoring newspaper
reports
and doing library research and then communicating that knowledge to
others
through the web site.
Somebody has to "know" what is really behind whatever is happening in
regard
to reducing the size of the NSW Upper House and be able to communicate
that
information to others. (Ditto for compulsory preferential etc).
I suspect this will be more difficult than it ought to be. My experience
is that in reality most of the people attracted to Neither don't give a
damn
about the details of electoral systems. But "somebody" has to know what
they
are talking about in that regard. I have done the research necessary on
the
Commonwealth despite finding the subject intensely boring, but have not
been interested enough to write up details in a situation where I know
my
friends just aren't interested. As a result I can make what I believe to
be
a very useful contribution in challenging assumptions people otherwise
tend
to make that we "must" support optional preferential and voluntary
voting -
assumptions insisted on by the media and the courts despite our never
having
had any such policy on either issue. But I definately cannot substitute
for the need for somebody in any campaign about the NSW parliamentary
system
taking a real interest in how it works.
