Am 09.09.24 um 09:48 schrieb Fabian Grünbichler: >> Thomas Lamprecht <t.lampre...@proxmox.com> hat am 06.09.2024 18:58 CEST >> geschrieben: >> Am 06/09/2024 um 12:40 schrieb Fiona Ebner: >>> Many people will use 'upgrade' instead of 'full-upgrade' or >>> 'dist-upgrade' (e.g. [0][1]) despite the documentation explicitly >>> mentioning 'dist-upgrade' [3]. Proxmox VE uses different packaging >>> guarantees than Debian and using 'upgrade' can lead to a broken >>> system [2]. > > just a slight nit here: you should only end up with a broken system if we > miss properly tracking some inter-package relationship. it can happen happen > (and probably does, from time to time), but in the vast majority of cases > "apt[-get] upgrade" should at most leave you stuck with an outdated system > (with APT telling you that there are still packages to be upgraded), not a > broken one. we did get a lot better about accounting for these things over > the past few years (but of course, we don't have anywhere close to the > infrastructure that Debian has for automated tracking and testing).
Okay, will change the commit message in v2. > >>> The match is kept simple, to not accidentally catch things like >>>> -o 'foo=bar upgrade baz' >>> and trip up advanced users. >>> >>> It does not catch invocations with '-y' either, making it less likely >>> to break automated user scripts. Although they should not use >>> 'upgrade' either, it still would be bad to break them. If the risk is >>> still considered too high, this change should wait until a major or >>> at least point release. >>> >>> To avoid false positives, it would be necessary to properly parse >>> options, which is likely not worth the effort. >>> >>> A downside is that the hook is only invoked after the user confirms >>> the upgrade, but there doesn't seem to be an early enough hook entry >>> (DPkg::Pre-Invoke is also too late). Since this is just an additional >>> safety warning to guide new users, it should still be good enough. >>> >>> [0]: https://forum.proxmox.com/threads/150217/post-680158 >>> [1]: https://forum.proxmox.com/threads/140580/post-630419 >>> [2]: >>> https://www.reddit.com/r/Proxmox/comments/ujqig9/use_apt_distupgrade_or_the_gui_not_apt_upgrade/ >>> [3]: >>> https://pve.proxmox.com/pve-docs/chapter-sysadmin.html#system_software_updates >>> >> >> yeah, it's something I considered here and then but never pulled through, >> as it just somehow doesn't feel right... >> >> But it's definitively a real problem, and so I surely won't block this on >> the basis of some gut feeling, I'd rather like to hear Fabian's opinion on >> it. > > given that I also use `apt upgrade` from time to time (habit from being an > unstable user ;)), and that it might alienate power users coming from Debian, > I'd prefer this to be a non-interactive warning with the text "disarmed" a > bit? > > something like > > !! WARNING !! > Since Proxmox VE follows a rolling release model, using 'upgrade' can lead to > a system being stuck on outdated versions, or in rare cases, break upon > upgrading. Use 'dist-upgrade' or 'full-upgrade' instead. > !! WARNING !! > > with or without a prompt (it's a pity that the hook is not executed with the > config before the regular confirmation prompt, else we could just depend on > that)? Sounds good. And since it is so rare, I'd just leave out the additional confirmation prompt then. _______________________________________________ pve-devel mailing list pve-devel@lists.proxmox.com https://lists.proxmox.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/pve-devel
