Hi Jacob, Martijn, all, thanks for your advises and input! IMHO it makes sense to wait a bit with discussing release plans or strategies until after the tasks and their interaction are more settled and somewhat commonly agreed. And until after we know a bit more on everyone's commitments and availabilities.
Maybe Carl Friedrich or Armin could kick this off once they think it makes sense to discuss release plans or strategies? best & happy days to you all! holger > Thanks for the feedback Martijn, some comments below > > onsdagen den 19 december 2007 skrev Martijn Faassen: > > Carl Friedrich Bolz wrote: > > > Just to inform you a bit: Several PyPy developers have sat together and > > > worked on a very rough roadmap for what tasks need to be done to make > > > PyPy a realistic replacement for CPython. The work is going on here: > > > > > > https://codespeak.net/svn/pypy/extradoc/planning/roadmap/ > > > > > > We plan to work on this some more in the next days. As soon as it is in > > > a more finished state we will ask write a mail to pypy-dev again and ask > > > for general feedback. > > > > Hey, > > > > I subscribed to the mailing list again. I'm very glad that this planning > > is taking place. > > > > Some feedback: > > > > If I read it correctly, the list seems more or less to be about an > > end-result to the process, a more or less "ideal" production release. > > Not quite idea perhaps -- library support may still be limited, but yet > > quite a lot of things are in there. That's good for a goal; one should > > set the sights high, and I'm sure the project is capable of > > accomplishing all this technically, eventually. > > > > I think it's also very important to space out how you get there: have > > nearer-term goals with releases that aim to be useful. > > I think some of the most important thinking that still that needs to go > > into this roadmap is to figure out how to space this out over multiple > > releases, where you have multiple releases of hopefully increasing > > usefulness. This way you set up a positive feedback cycle where people > > test things and hopefully people will be motivated in contributing in > > useful places (libraries and such, and reporting bugs). At least, > > waiting until all of this is completed sounds like it would take quite a > > while as there are many tasks involved. > > The roadmap is part of a multi step process. After we get acceptance from > people in the project on where we want to go, the next step is outlining how > to get there. I hope that people will conclude that the best way to go about > things is to make a series of releases, but we will see. Releases take a lot > of effort and there is a balance to strike between producing and releasing. > > > To get to a list of projected releases, you could restrict your > > ambitions along various dimensions. For instance, you could focus on > > only supporting one or a limited amount of backends for a first release. > > Or you could defer erformance optimizations. Alternatively you could > > restrict the amount of libraries you are going to implement (this is > > already in the roadmap, but on the other hand the support for a GUI > > toolkit is in there too). I'm sure other dimensions exist that I can't > > even think of. > > I think the roadmap is a set of restrictions. To be a viable replacement for > CPython, there is a single backend that needs to be supported. We are not > focusing on the JVM or .NET in this roadmap and we are not talking about > support for other languages. For libraries, I think that is something that is > absolutely necessary in order to get traction among Python users. While it > would be nice if someone comes along and ports a GUI library, I don't think > we can count on that happening. It is in any case a task that belongs near > the end of a timeline with releases. > > So, the roadmap reflects our current understanding of what we have to do to > have a system that can attain critical mass and become a major Python > implementation, hopefully supplanting CPython one day. I am certain we will > have reason to revise the roadmap along the way, dropping some tasks and > introducing others. Unfortunately, there are a large number of things that > have to get done, but that is to a large extent the consequences of Python > being a fairly old and well established programming language. > > Jacob > _______________________________________________ > [email protected] > http://codespeak.net/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev > -- merlinux GmbH Steinbergstr. 42 31139 Hildesheim http://merlinux.de tel +49 5121 20800 75 (fax 77) _______________________________________________ [email protected] http://codespeak.net/mailman/listinfo/pypy-dev
