On 08. 12. 21 1:47, Victor Stinner wrote:
For me, HPy is the only valid stable API and stable ABI in the long
term which is efficient on any Python implementation. Its design is
very different than the C API: HPy avoids all C API design mistakes,
it doesn't leak any implementation detail.
HPy can already be used today on CPython, even if it's not directly
provided by CPython.
Providing HPy as a first-class citizen in CPython, as already done in
PyPy, would be great to promote HPy! However, HPy evolves quickly and
so needs to be released more frequently than CPython. At least, we
could promote it more in the C API documentation, as we already
promote Cython.
Promoting the HPy usage doesn't solve any issue listed in PEP 620, 670
and 674 since CPython still has to continue supporting the C API. We
will only be fully free to make any change in Python internals without
having to care about breaking the C API once the *LAST* C extensions
using the C API will disappear... Look at Python 2.7 which is still
used in 2021. I bet that C extensions using the C API are not doing to
disappear soon.
For me, the question is:
=> Is it ok to no longer be able to make any change in Python
internals because of the public C API?
The sub-question is:
=> Is it ok to have a slow deprecation process and wait 5 to 10 years
until it will be possible again to evolve the Python internals?
No, they should be evolved when they *need* to be evolved.
This PEP calls for breaking things because they *might* need evolving in
the future, but doesn't presemt any immediate benefit. In that case, I
think it's better document that we don't like some usage, but only do
the removals when they're helpful.
Especially in cases where there can't be a proper deprecation period.
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