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You know what?
The bottom line is, it's too late to leave.
We can't leave now, if we looked bad to the world for going into Iraq imagine how we would look just leaving after starting and killing the innocent civilians.
I don't like this war but reality tells me leaving would be the worst move yet.
Stunt you might be right or wrong about Kerry, I really don't know but at least he went voluntarily to Nam and fought when Bush was too busy partying back at home sheltered by his father and any one thinks different is not in step with reality no matter what documents say any different.
At least acknowledge that.
Mark
-------Original Message-------
Date: 06/20/06 15:54:35
Subject: Re: [QUAD-L] MSNBC.com Article: Avoiding attacking suspected terrorist master...
NOW the Iraqis are fighting with us.
They've been dying at higher rates than coalition forces.
Just because the MEDIA refuses to report all of the regions that've become peaceful, and turns a blind eye towards Iraqi children grinning from ear to ear while getting their picture taken WITH US soldiers doesn't mean it doesn't happen everyday.
I've seen the pics brought back... and friends who VOLUNTEERED to go back for a THIRD tour over there have shared their thoughts with me.
For every disgruntled soldier, you can find at least two who believes we are doing the right thing.
S, Korea cost us ~50,000 dead in 3 years. That's not including wounded. We'll be out of Iraq within a couple of years if things keep progressing..
50 years later we're STILL in S. Korea, and a day may come when we'll have to finish it.
For those of us who were soldiers during Nam, we were doing our job to hold off Communism. S. Vietnam didn't fall to the North "while" we were there. But it seems to be a cultural thing, because of their belief systems, most of the people adapted well to Communism.
I try not to buy into all the "conspiracy theory" stuff myself.
Americans wouldn't change w/o a blood bath that wouldn't stop for decades at least, even if nuked.
Stunt
On 6/20/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Strange thing freedom,
You can't give it away. S.korea isn't costing us 7000 casualties and 150 billion dollars a year with no potential of working out. S. korea actually wanted us and fought shoulder to shoulder with us. Vietname was morally wrong to get involved in. Gulf of tonkin ws a lie.
Leaving iraq has a positive side to it once you get into reality and stop thinking they love us. First off, it goes into a shiite sunni civil war that draws persians against arabs. This gets nasty real fast and remember osama, he is a sunni sitting in the middle of shiites.(thats why he got upset with zarqawi for bombing shiite mosques). While this is happening our special forces ghacve a chance to get serious work done, ie. iran. I personnally dont care about saudi Arabia and the rest of them, they areen't our friends they are the insurgents. Perpetuating a bad position isn't cutting and running Mr Custer.
Not cut and run, engage and manuvre.Who wants to be the last person to get die Because the C.O. wants to be loved
john
In a message dated 6/17/2006 2:39:07 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Strange thing Freedom....
Once one gets a taste, it's more addictive to one's soul than drugs..... to those who didn't grow up in it through the selfless sacrifices of their ancestors.... Peolpe forget how many years we stayed in Germany and Japan, and we're STILL in S. Korea.
But we now here BS about "quagmire", calling sophmoric degradidations torture, claiming we're worse than the beheaders and real torturers and comparisons to Vietnam, while all the positive news is ignored, like "women voting and holding office in an Arab country (that's 2 now).
We gave into liberal propaganda (speaking of the majority of public support) during Vietnam, {1] when the "Useful Idiots" like hanoi jane and komrade kerry decieved America, we created "no fire zones etc, which eliminated any chance of victory and signed a cease fire agreement.
When the North Vietnamese violated the Cease fire Agreement, the Democratic leadership faulted on our promise and over a million civilians were slaughtered in Vietnam and Cambodia as the "Peacful Communists" (according to the "Useful Idiots") took them over.
A new generation, unaware of the truth that the "Useful Idiots" caused, are now bombarded by the same style propaganda, and bin hidden is counting on them just like Ho Chi Mein did.
[1] This was not the only problem, as then, like now, "politicians" thought they were better qualified to run the war.
The TERRORISTS (I refuse to call foriegn suicide bombers "insurgents") are fighting to PREVENT stability and hope to start civil war, BUT THE IRAQI's ARE NOW TELLING US WHO THEY ARE and where they're hiding.
The only hope we have of a long term solution is proving the Terrorists wrong by exposing the people to the truth.
Presently the "Hate Bush " first crowd is muddying that water of hope by aiding with propaganda that America is Bad and blowing things out of proportion instead of waiting for the truth to come out.
I met a new para a couple of weeks ago at the Hines VA SCI unit, who was sorry he couldn't go back to fight in Iraq.
Doesn't sound like a bad guy to me. But it does make this an SCI topic.
Stunt
On 6/15/06, RollinOn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
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It's going to be real interesting to see how they use their Freedom, I just hope we're not building the largest Terrorist Army in the Middle East.
Mark
-------Original Message-------
Date: 06/15/06 16:50:59
Subject: Re: [QUAD-L] MSNBC.com Article: Avoiding attacking suspected terrorist master...
According to the History channel, that was a 'pay-back' to Russia for supporting the commies in Viet Nam. I love seeing how all this intertwined crap eventually comes back to bite one on his flap surgery spot. I sure hope the Iraqis use their new freedom and power to smite their fellow towel-heads instead of turning on us. Possibly if Isreal would help the Iraqis, they could protect their own future a bit too. Who knows?
Dave
In a message dated 6/15/2006 2:09:01 P.M. US Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
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Think about this for a second, we are now helping a country build an army that we might very well be fighting in the future.
Real Smart thinking!
Don't forget we helped Osama defeat the Soviet Union.
Mark
-------Original Message-------
Date: 06/15/06 13:50:01
Subject: Re: [QUAD-L] MSNBC.com Article: Avoiding attacking suspected terrorist master...
Exactly Dave!
Killing any of them is not going to change the fact that we are dealing with people that ultimately want infidels dead and off their holy land. I see that many people think we Americans are trying to help the iraqi people, but ultimatly, we are sending our soldiers to die and be mutilated. When I see American politicians talking about agreements with Saudis, Kuwaitis, Egyptians, iraqis and Jordanians, I get a sinking feeling in my heart.
These people want our money so they can kill us for having troops in their holy lands. It doesn't matter if we had the most noble reason for going their. We shouldn't go their! The Israelis will never find peace there, only periods when the killing subsides.
I'm all for having a special part of the CIA and special forces to deal with wahabbists that are planning and plotting against the US. If we had done nothing when Saddam grabbed Kuwait, he would have been stuck the arab world and the wahabbists against him. We would be having gas wars again so the Saudis and Iraq could finance their paranoia. Saddam would have most likely been asasinated by now and his idiot sons would be trying another war against Iran. We could have been sitting in the easy seat pulling strings and wahabbist palestinians would be blowing themselves up in Tehran and Bagdad. The twin towers would still be standing and our soldiers would still be alive.
I'm so tired of people that think this is a liberral/conservative issue.
Stunt, you mentioned a "pact" between FDR and the king of Saudi Arabia in 44. FDR promised not to back a jewish homeland in palestine if the Saudi's wouldn't nationalize the Aramco wells.
john
In a message dated 6/13/2006 5:49:34 PM Eastern Daylight Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Hi Stunt,
Everyone should Google 'Wahhabi' and read about what the enemy is teaching in the Mosques and schools in the Islamic World.
With Love,
CtrlAltDel aka Dave
C4/5 Complete - 30 Years Post
Texas, USA
How many Americans know that FDR was the one who made the pact with
the Royal Saudi family? Every President since has honored it.
Forget the PROPAGANDA!
This new round was designed to undermine the victory of taking out
Zarquwi, nothing more. The so called "Progressive Liberal" media hates
President Bush so much, that they "feel" compelled to dig up old BS
just to try to take away from the taking out of a brutal butcher who
was doing everything he could to try to start a civil war.
We "Gave Peace a chance", and 9/11 was our reward.
WAKE UP!
Stunt
On 6/10/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
>
> The 1st gulf war caused all the ensueing problems. Why did we go there? We
> were mercenairies for the Saudis and kuwaitis. We even made a profit on the
> 1st gulf war? Why wasn't that profit shared with the troops that fought?
> Because it was wrong! The Bush family has a strange way of picking friends
> and destroying friendships. Sure wish they had some love for all the
> American families they have harmed. Stop living in the past and start paying
> attention to the truth. Saudis and kuwaitis hate our guts. With careful
> foriegn policy, so does most of the world!
>
> john
>
> In a message dated 6/9/2006 12:23:40 AM Eastern Daylight Time,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> An article from 2004? Stop living in the past. Do you want to dig up every
> article that talks about what if the Clinton administration had attacked
> Osama bin Laden when it had a chance then all the thousands of deaths that
> happened since could have been avoided. Sept 11, 2001 would not have
> happened if the Clinton administration had acted after the first WTC attack,
> the USS Cole attack, the US embassies attacked.
>
> At 06:14 PM 6/8/2006, River Wolfe wrote:
> Avoiding attacking suspected terrorist mastermind
> The Bush administration had several chances to attack and destroy a
> suspected terrorist operation with ties to al-Qaida but never pulled
> the trigger._ NBC's Jim Miklaszewski reports.
> http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/4431601/from/ET/
>
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